So what the helll....

  • We are currently upgrading MFK. thanks! -neo
tank125;1737680; said:
Miles - quote:
I have 2 "teacups" that would have to say that PraziPro makes a huge profound effect on whatever was effecting their digestion issues internally. I've done a controlled test on the 5 I just got, and it's amazing the difference in the 2 that received a 4x dose of Prazi. Perhaps it's not used in proper concentration most of the time because of their unique osmosis system and the way they process fluids in their body. ;)

Prazipro is effective on Tapeworms and Gillflukes, and possibly some round worms. I think that your results were just coincidence. The osmoregulation of a ray has nothing to do with Prazi's effect on a worm. Prazi is not a broad spectrum anti-parasitic.

A few would oppose the view of osmoregulation having nothing to do with the intake of water into their body.. but I don't think much study has been done on it.

What classifies broad spectrum? Any links?

Praziquantel (Praziquantel 100%, ProfessionalPharmacy Services Inc., USA) is an antihelminthic used for the treatment of both internal and external platyhelminthes. Praziquantel has been applied as a bath to treat monogeneans for a period of 48 hours (2-20 days in the case of the sandbar shark). When applying praziquantel baths, activated carbon filtration, ozone dosing, and UV irradiation should be discontinued. Never use praziquantel in the presence of copper or trichlorfon. Praziquantel has been used in elasmobranchs to treat trematodes and cestodes as an oral treatment for 3 days a week, over three consecutive weeks of treatment.

Pathogen diagnosis in Elasmobranch
The ability to correctly identify pathogenic organisms (e.g., monogeneans, cestodes, nematodes, crustaceans, protozoans, bacteria, etc.), in combination with an understanding of their life history, will lead workers to make informed diagnoses and implement more effective treatments. In particular, it is important to understand primary and secondary health concerns. For example, it may be determined that an outbreak of monogeneans has been exacerbated by the presence of environmental stressors (e.g., poor water quality, high population density, etc.). Once monogeneans have infested a population of elasmobranchs, a secondary bacterial infection may ensue and ultimately result in specimen mortality. Any treatment regime should thus address the primary infection (i.e., monogeneans), the secondary infection (i.e., bacteria), and importantly, any conditions that have aided the disease process (i.e., poor water quality and/or high population density), for the regime to be effective.

Monogeneans represent the greatest challenge to newly-arrived elasmobranchs. These organisms are difficult to eradicate because of their ability to remain viable, without a host, for extended periods of time. Control of these pathogens, through quarantine, is recommended. If quarantine is impractical, serious consideration should be given to the application of a medicated bath(e.g.,praziquantel)before elasmobranchs are moved into their destination aquarium.

I think I am smart because I can copy and paste.:popcorn:;)




I am sorry for the losses Rudy.. did you medicate with anything? :WHOA: It could have killed the rays.. ! but the Scientists do recommend a Prazi bath as a pre-treatment..
 
Miles;1737816; said:
Praziquantel (Praziquantel 100%, ProfessionalPharmacy Services Inc., USA) is an antihelminthic used for the treatment of both internal and external platyhelminthes. Praziquantel has been applied as a bath to treat monogeneans for a period of 48 hours (2-20 days in the case of the sandbar shark). When applying praziquantel baths, activated carbon filtration, ozone dosing, and UV irradiation should be discontinued. Never use praziquantel in the presence of copper or trichlorfon. Praziquantel has been used in elasmobranchs (elasmobranchs = cartilaginous fish, ie RAYS) to treat trematodes (trematodes = flatworms, aka flukes) and cestodes (cestodes = tapeworms) as an oral treatment for 3 days a week, over three consecutive weeks of treatment.


Thank you for the copy and paste reiteration. Some definitions to further boost the usefulness of this thread, in magenta.
 
wow........:ROFL: keep going you guys :popcorn:


tank125;1737680; said:
Miles - quote:
I have 2 "teacups" that would have to say that PraziPro makes a huge profound effect on whatever was effecting their digestion issues internally. I've done a controlled test on the 5 I just got, and it's amazing the difference in the 2 that received a 4x dose of Prazi. Perhaps it's not used in proper concentration most of the time because of their unique osmosis system and the way they process fluids in their body. ;)


That is awesome, were you lucky enough to find any parasite carcasses? How was this test laid out? 2 @ 4xdose, other 3 @??? Prazipro is effective on Tapeworms and Gillflukes, and possibly some round worms. I think that your results were just coincidence. The osmoregulation of a ray has nothing to do with Prazi's effect on a worm. Prazi is not a broad spectrum anti-parasitic.


Rudy:

The zipping around the tank all crazy could be pH crash, which you ruled out, right?

Could be Gill Flukes - Now we know it is safe to use Prazipro, you may want to do a preventative treatment of it to rule out Gill Flukes.

Internal bacteria? Are there any other symptoms besides the crazy swimming, which would not be associated with internal bacterial infections. If you feel you need to use something, Oxytetracyclin or Maracyn II SHOULD be safe. Both are effective broad spectrum antibiotics. The concern with them is that they are skin irritants so they migh bother the unprotected belly of the ray. I recently used Maracyn II on a Tigrinus (scaleless) with no ill effects. First I tried Kanamycin Sulfate but that irritated the hell out of him (sulfates in the Kana and sulfites in the Prime).


tetracylene is a med i would not recomend for rays.... maracyn and maracyn 2 are ok i have used them many times...


you just recomended maracyn 2 are you saying the bacteria could only be gram negative as that is what maracyn 2 is meant for...
 
Nic;1738026; said:
wow........:ROFL: keep going you guys :popcorn:





tetracylene is a med i would not recomend for rays.... maracyn and maracyn 2 are ok i have used them many times...


you just recomended maracyn 2 are you saying the bacteria could only be gram negative as that is what maracyn 2 is meant for...


why no tetracline?
 
Miles;1738759; said:

monogeneans?


Well, I guess your copy/paste contradicts itself? Maybe you should copy/paste from only one source, when you mix two without reading them or understanding all the big words you manage to post something that contradicts itself. Although it seemed like a good idea to use all those big words to make yourself appear smart, it actually didn't work that way. Guess you should stay in school kid!
 
tank125;1738118; said:
why no tetracline?



tetracylene is pretty harsh.... i wouldnt use it and was advised not to use it on rays from others...


im curious as to only the recommendation for a gram neg bacteria med though??
 
What does harsh mean? Are you referring to the fact that it is a skin irritant like I mentioned before? That could be an issue, but if it is, just do a water change and add some carbon and discontinue use. Such an effect would be evident within the first hours of use.


Please elaborate on this gram negative vs gram positive issue. Why is Maracyn II only effective against a gram negative bacterium? What is different about gram positive bacterium? How does one combat them? What are some common fish ailments caused by gram positive bacterium?
 
tank125;1739799; said:
Please elaborate on this gram negative vs gram positive issue. Why is Maracyn II only effective against a gram negative bacterium? What is different about gram positive bacterium? How does one combat them? What are some common fish ailments caused by gram positive bacterium?

tank125;1739005; said:
Guess you should stay in school kid!

H'rm.
 
tank125;1739005; said:
Well, I guess your copy/paste contradicts itself? Maybe you should copy/paste from only one source, when you mix two without reading them or understanding all the big words you manage to post something that contradicts itself.

They were copy/pasted from the same source. The Elasmobranch Husbandry Manual.
http://www.colszoo.org/internal/elasmo_2005/page2.htm
Help yourself..



Although it seemed like a good idea to use all those big words to make yourself appear smart, it actually didn't work that way. Guess you should stay in school kid!

I even admitted I copy/pasted it.. so how would that be _ME_ using all the big words to appear smart? I didn't type a single "big word".. just pasted it, like I said, in my first post.

So... Uh.. ?

I was hoping you could elaborate some more on your sage knowledge or parasitic analogies.

Please advise..

monogeneans?

I even put it in Magenta.. to help you out. (google it if you have to)

What school did you go to? Haha..
 
MonsterFishKeepers.com