some stuff

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I disagree- when it comes to mambas and the quicker/ more aggressive cobras like melanoleuca, the only safe way to handle them is using a trap box or shift cage. You should certainly know how to handle a snake but why risk yourself every time you clean a water bowl? I have had to get a couple of dendroaspis into deli cups before and I do not care how experienced you are- there will be a time when a snake like that gains the advantage. Better safe than sorry.

Rob, that last snake was a carpet python.
 
Notice what my mamba is coiled on? I absolutely use trap boxes when doing some routine watering and spot cleaning. My point was not to go out and buy a cobra thinking you can just use a trap box. There are lots of guys that have venomous snakes and have no clue how to use a hook. A trap box is a tool not a failsafe.
 
snakeguy101 said:
Rob, that last snake was a carpet python.
Click to expand...

Thank you.

Question for you experienced guys. What would be the difficulty of keeping a copperhead? I'm only asking to satisfy my curiosity, there's not chance of it ever actually happening. My wife puts up with a lot of my eccentricities, but venomous snakes is one she's put her foot down on, especially with my new son in the house.

Where would it fall on the scale of difficulty to keep? Would it be something that a dedicated amateur could keep? I can't imagine it being harder to manage than a really nasty water snake.
 
They are very easy to keep husbandry wise. And the venom is relatively weak as far as venomous goes. Just a little common sense goes a long way. Never put your hands on a venomous snake. and never ever reach into an enclosure housing a venomous snake with your hands. Always keep enclosures locked. Always have a bite protocol in place just in case. As easy as all this sounds there are experienced venomous keepers that get complacent and break these rules. Common sense.
 
Hots are not something you learn as you go. If you (or anyone reading this) wants a venomous reptile, even a "beginner one" like a copperhead, you need to be trained first. Nothing I can say here could ever come close to even just a few days with a good mentor.
 
I agree. But Training is hard to come by Chris. Depending on your location, good luck finding a "competent" keeper/handler that is willing to teach and take the liability of teaching you with his/her personal snakes. I know i wouldn't. Not worth the risks for me. In two years hots will be untouchable legally to the private sector anyway. All the complete morons free handling and getting bit have definitely ruined the hobby. But it's for our own good. Unfortunately some of the biggest douches are venomous keepers. It's true. And the dealers are even worse. Guys out to make a buck selling venomous to anyone 18 with the cash. I was messing around with a vendor that i didn't know well once and said that little neonate black mamba can't kill me yet. It's too small to penetrate my skin. He said oh yes he can. And proceeded to ask me my credit card information....more worried about the cash than not mine, but possibly someone else life. Who cares about the douche who bought the snake, let natural selection run its course. But the innocent people that might come in contact with the snake when escapes it's make shift cage that the douche threw together because he spent all his money on the cool cobra and someone dies. That's where it's for OUR OWN GOOD comes from.
 
Thanks for the info guys. I have no desire to have one in my private collection, I was just curious.

There is a real chance that I'm going to be working with them in the future as my major is Ecology and Evolutionary Biology. Once I'm out of the army I'm going to try to get work in that field instead of doing the crap I did in the service. There's a real chance that I'll end up at a zoo or wildlife preserve or something and I'll be able to get my fix there, no need to have them in the house. :)
 
In FL it is required that you have 1000 hours of hands on training from a licensed individual. I try to let people that are really interested come over to work with my collection but I am always in the room watching what they are doing. For me it is worth it to properly train the next venomous keepers properly and not let them fall victim to the less educated keepers that make headlines.

Am I correct in thinking that MI is one of the states that has no regulations regarding venomous snakes? I think those states will be first to get them banned. The states with good permit systems in place will likely keep the hobby alive (although it will be small and stifled). In my opinion FL has a good model to follow. Required documented training, very well designed caging requirements, a preliminary/ annual inspection, and an affordable cost. If all states had a similar set of regulations this industry would last a lot longer. The good news is that you can bet that the federal gov't will never rule on a sub-culture this small so there will always be some states where you can keep venomous reptiles.

As far as vendors go- there are always going to be scumbags. I work at a Repticon show in South Carolina (where there are no regulations) as venomous staff and have refused to let people leave with a snake when I over heard one guy saying that he would use a bent coat hanger for a hook and another one asking his buddy to refer to a puff adder as a ball python so that his GF would not get mad. On the other hand, 95% of the folks there do their part in making sure buyers know what they are getting into and most buyers know their limits.

Don't be so cynical. This hobby has some years left in it.
 
If venom 1 shuts down, not even zoos will keep venomous anymore. Florida has great laws on exotics. No doubt about that. How about Texas? Walk into Walmart and buy a permit as easy as a fishing license...
 
Do either of you have any guidance for me on how to go about getting a permit? I'm originally from Florida but I'm facing a situation where I might not be able to move back after the Army because of my love of 'banned' animals (tigerfish). I've read the law that specifically states that you can get permits, but there's no real guidance on how to go about doing so. I've not had much luck with google, either; I think that I might not know what to look for if that makes any sense.
 
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