It was mine, had two pair, but the pair in the pic killed the other pair when they spawned, had to give them away when I moved
South American & New World Cichlids.
- Thread starter Angelbugbear
- Start date
If I had 4 severum and two paired off, would they be a problem to the other two, ie as my angels have been in the past?
If so, would two be better than 4?
If I had 4 severum and two paired off, would they be a problem to the other two, ie as my angels have been in the past?
If so, would two be better than 4?
I am worried for the severums, but seeing the pictures of you sajica has made me want one even moreI believe the reason dither fish are recommended is because cichlids watch the action of dither fish to judge safety and comfort, and if dither fish aren't present in nature, it tells them to hide. They also often occupy a different area of the water column, than the cichlids inhabit.
So without dithers, your cichlids may often do more hiding than not.
My experience with sajica, is also that it is a bit more aggressive than its South Americans cousins, and it may see the severums (being the same shape) as competitors to be vanquished.
I am very fond sajica, and find they do fine with live bearers as dithers, and more elongate cichlids as tank mates, dis-similar in appearance, but other round pan shaped cichlids could be beaten to death. You may have leeway in a 150 if they all grow up together.
If I had 4 severum and two paired off, would they be a problem to the other two, ie as my angels have been in the past?
If so, would two be better than 4?
I am worried for the severums, but seeing the pictures of you sajica has made me want one even more
That is definitely a possibility. The pair may get violent with the two non-paired severums. What I would do, is get your four, and let it play out. Who knows, you may not get pairs. And with only buying two, I would be worried that the dominant one would bully the subdom, especially if they are both males. If you get four, and two form a pair, they might not bother the other two. If they do, you could then just re-home the remaining two and stick with the pair.
you can expect a similar aggression level as you experienced with breeding angels, but severums get much larger and more powerful. but your tank should be large enough for the other fish to stay clear.
personally, i would mix it up with your larger cichlids. one severum, one chocolate, one festivum, one threadfin, etc. there are a lot of good choices for sa medium sized community cichlids. but if your thing is severums then theres no big problem there either.
For me an important determiner for what type cichlids I keep, and have kept over the years (beyond the obvious aggressive tendencies and my self imposed tank size restrictions)), is the mineral composition of tap water.
My tap water in the midwest was hard, relatively high pH, and alkaline. This to me precluded keeping South American specie from much of the Amazon region (those that required soft, low mineral content, tannin rich) water.
I tried in my younger says, keeping Heros, and Satanoperca and a few other with not a great deal of success. And more recently,
I would have loved to keep Uaru fernadezeyepezi, wild type angels, and those certain Geophagines, but my tap water, would have made this difficult, and led to chronic problems like HLLE and digestive maladies, for those more sensitive species without extensive addition of tannins, and maybe a mix of tap RO.
So more than simply what I desired, I found working with what I was dealt with, water wise, was a better standard practice for me.
This meant, keeping Central American, South Americans from west of the Andes, or those from cooler places like southern Brazil, and Uruguay where the water parameters were naturally more similar to mine.
In my "show tanks" being geographically correct is also important to me, some may think this anal, maybe so.
So if your tap water is hard, sajica may be a good fit, if soft, sticking with the South American of Amazonia may be the ticket, if neutral, them if you don't care about being geographically correct, why not, any mix you find interesting.
My tap water in the midwest was hard, relatively high pH, and alkaline. This to me precluded keeping South American specie from much of the Amazon region (those that required soft, low mineral content, tannin rich) water.
I tried in my younger says, keeping Heros, and Satanoperca and a few other with not a great deal of success. And more recently,
I would have loved to keep Uaru fernadezeyepezi, wild type angels, and those certain Geophagines, but my tap water, would have made this difficult, and led to chronic problems like HLLE and digestive maladies, for those more sensitive species without extensive addition of tannins, and maybe a mix of tap RO.
So more than simply what I desired, I found working with what I was dealt with, water wise, was a better standard practice for me.
This meant, keeping Central American, South Americans from west of the Andes, or those from cooler places like southern Brazil, and Uruguay where the water parameters were naturally more similar to mine.
In my "show tanks" being geographically correct is also important to me, some may think this anal, maybe so.
So if your tap water is hard, sajica may be a good fit, if soft, sticking with the South American of Amazonia may be the ticket, if neutral, them if you don't care about being geographically correct, why not, any mix you find interesting.
Hi. I have hard water PH 8. I know severum etc are better in Ph lower than 7, but I have been assured that the fish are fine in harder water these days having been bred and kept in local water. My local fish shop told me theirs are in PH 8, the same as my tap water, and they have them in their display tanks as well as for sale.This has been on my mind before I read your post, and have already had doubts over long term success of the tank. Its also the reason I am not setting up a Discus tank. The wood I have bought for the tank is spider wood, which I am told does not affect PH or leek tannins. I want healthy happy fish, and not just fish that survive. I have no interest in RO water, so any choice has to be happy/healthy in treated tap water.
Luckily I have time to think this over again as tank is still a couple of weeks away from delivery.
Thank you for your view point, I will take it seriously.
Thank you. I was thinking this was a good plan, however, having now found out my local water might be a problem, I might now have to give up the love affair with severums before it even starts.
Local water might be a problem, so maybe your idea of a mix group of fish minus the severum might be the way forward.
Although the Heros that have been bred over many generations in aquariums should be able to handle pH 8, for long time, many mature specimens I have seen (like oscars) end up with HLLE and other scaring over time, from chronic osmotic and bacterial stress. This may have more to do with the lack of tannins than just the pH itself, the tannins are antimicrobial. In many rivers its the change between the dry season, (where pH rises) and the rainy season that lowers pH and washes more tannins from the forest floor into the river, inhibiting bacteria, and giving the fishes immune system a helping hand
If it were me, with your high pH, I'd opt for species endemic to that higher mineral content realm.
The red hump Geos (steinadchneri, crassilabrus, or pellegrini) from west of the Andes, or Gymnogeophagines of southern South America would be my Geophagine choices. These do better as harums of 1 male to 3 or 4 females
Gymnogeophagus quilero above, species Paso Pache below
And instead of Heros, if going the Central American route, the sajica would be perfect. As are other Amatitlania like cutteri below
Central America also has Geophagine equivalents in the Cribroheros and Thorichthys genera
below Cribroheros rostrum
they also do well in shoals
robertsoni
and longimanus
The one caveat, would be that Uruguayan and other southern South American are sub-tropical, and need a seasonal cool down to retain best of health so housing them with some Central Americans poses temp problems. In my Gymnogeophagus tanks, I never used heaters at all. Also from the cooler seasonal waters of Uruguay Australoheros sp. Red Ceibal below
If it were me, with your high pH, I'd opt for species endemic to that higher mineral content realm.
The red hump Geos (steinadchneri, crassilabrus, or pellegrini) from west of the Andes, or Gymnogeophagines of southern South America would be my Geophagine choices. These do better as harums of 1 male to 3 or 4 females
Gymnogeophagus quilero above, species Paso Pache below
And instead of Heros, if going the Central American route, the sajica would be perfect. As are other Amatitlania like cutteri below
Central America also has Geophagine equivalents in the Cribroheros and Thorichthys genera
below Cribroheros rostrum
they also do well in shoals
robertsoni
and longimanus
The one caveat, would be that Uruguayan and other southern South American are sub-tropical, and need a seasonal cool down to retain best of health so housing them with some Central Americans poses temp problems. In my Gymnogeophagus tanks, I never used heaters at all. Also from the cooler seasonal waters of Uruguay Australoheros sp. Red Ceibal below
