Sump design

[Conner]

I have exactly the kind of baffle you mention in my other sump, and it actually creates an enormous amount of bubbles when the water level gets low enough that its pouring over the baffle (it's 6" high, if I remember correctly). It agitates the water enough that the pumps don't draw it in evenly, and it ends up shooting tons of tiny little bubbles into the tank. I think it would actually be better without that baffle, unless you were to add yet another baffle beyond it to control the splashing.

I do like that if something goes wrong, the pump can't empty the entire sump of water, leaving all biomedia dry, but I think it'll be better without that baffle.

I plan on half of the biomedia that I need to be taken from the existing sump that's currently running on my other 125g tank, and adding one of the bacteriological starters as well. That way it will be basically instantly cycled, and I won't have to worry about cycling it too much.

I don't have a set schedule for getting the rays, I'm just hoping to have everything done, ready, and be able to purchase them in around that time frame. If it happens sooner or later, that's fine. But I won't purchase the rays until the tank is up and running and ready for them. They're expensive enough not to make a mistake that stupid.

 

[Jgray152]

Jgray152- are you sure 1/2" will be enough space for the water flow in the second baffle? I'm planning on running around 1500-2500gph on this sump, because of its future inhabitants. I want to make sure it won't back up and overflow the first chamber.

It would be enough but the issue is that at such a high flow rate you may have the water being forced out with greater velocity and could make a mess. At those speeds, I would space it out some, maybe an inch.

a .5" x 12" gap has a 6" total area. I think your sump is 12" wide right? Thats equivalent to a 2.77" diameter pipe.

If your going to use it for a 125 gallon tank with rays, You may wan't more mechanical filtration cross section surface area. So I would keep the second baffle where it is and move the first baffle out toward it give you an inch of gap. This wil allow the mechanical media last longer without clogging up as quick.

Remember that the water level in the first section of the filter if going to only be an inch or two below the rim (according to the drawing). So you sponges will be completly under water the entire time.

I would lower the top of the bio filtration so that the initial water level is lowered to a safer level.

 

[Conner]

Well, I've been looking at this thing, and looking at my other sump, and looking at some online, and I think I can make this a lot easier and maximize biomedia volume at the same time. Here's a new drawing I did up to show what I'm planning on doing. How does it look?

Oh, the drip plate will be at about the 11.5-12" level, to give room for the filter mat I'll be laying on top of it. Will that work?

 

[Dr Joe]

Now get it built

Dr Joe

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[greengiant]

just a question on the second drawing don't you want the eggcrate below the biomedia so when the water flows down you gain all the surface area? with the eggcrate only covering the gap below wouldn't you just end up with channelling and lose the benefit of all the biomedia? I am going to be building one soon myself but I have been trying to read up on how to do it best. my first attempt is going to be a 20G sump for a 50G tank. second question do you still need to use air pumps when you run a wet dry or do they get enough o2 contact in the W/D?

PS: not trying to hijack just asking some questions that I havent heard before that may be relevant

 

[hybridtheoryd16]

If your going to house rays in a month, you better get moving as it's going to take a month to cycle this thing enough to support that kind of bio-load.

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Isn't that the idea of a W/D? (I just had to say that)

With a cover and weekly WC's I don't see that as a problem.

Dr Joe

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Yes the W in W/d stands for WET (aka submerged aka under water) and the D in W/D stands for DRY (aka not under water). In that design and in the worst case, the media would be left dry only. If the out let from the tank stopped up and the main tank over flowed, etc,etc. But if a baffle was added there would be no way for the pump to empty the sump. I understand that these are pretty far fetched, but sh*t does happen. Also the idea of a W/D sump is for some (usually 2/3rds) of the media to be submerged. I also did not see where the OP said anything about this being a W/D sump. It could be a wet sump, a W/D sump, Or a dry sump. But i too assumed that it was the normal W/D. (sorry for any confusion, was just trying to cover the safety side to the fullest.)

 

[hybridtheoryd16]

just a question on the second drawing don't you want the eggcrate below the biomedia so when the water flows down you gain all the surface area? with the eggcrate only covering the gap below wouldn't you just end up with channelling and lose the benefit of all the biomedia? I am going to be building one soon myself but I have been trying to read up on how to do it best. my first attempt is going to be a 20G sump for a 50G tank. second question do you still need to use air pumps when you run a wet dry or do they get enough o2 contact in the W/D?

PS: not trying to hijack just asking some questions that I havent heard before that may be relevant

Yea that design would have some major channeling going on. The whole lower left hand side of the media would be void of any flow IMO. And the dry or dripping action of a W/D sump will give you more than enough gasing of the water going thru it. So no air pump would be needed.

 

[greengiant]

so like this would be better?

 

[Dr Joe]

As long as the bio-media is kept clean, channeling should not be a problem, the drip plate, water turbulence and aeration will keep the flow in check so anaerobic areas won't develop and all bio-media will be used (this is a small filter).

Yep, that's the generic W/D (see hybridtheoryd16 post for definition) from which all have evolved. Just put aeration under the bio-media for best results.

Dr Joe

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[Jgray152]

just a question on the second drawing don't you want the eggcrate below the biomedia so when the water flows down you gain all the surface area? with the eggcrate only covering the gap below wouldn't you just end up with channelling and lose the benefit of all the biomedia?

Yea that design would have some major channeling going on. The whole lower left hand side of the media would be void of any flow IMO. And the dry or dripping action of a W/D sump will give you more than enough gasing of the water going thru it. So no air pump would be needed.

You gain more than you loose. First of all, The entire sump would NOT be full of water so the diagram with the "channeling" is wrong. Your only going to have about about 6" of water or less. You don't need much. THe only channeling you will get is way over on the left side. This is why some commercial companies make a "ramp" on that left side to reduce that and keep the egg crate or something of high quality in its place.

Basically, don't worry about it. If your worried, silicone in a glass ramp.

Also the idea of a W/D sump is for some (usually 2/3rds) of the media to be submerged.

2/3s is too much. Go with a good canister if your going to do that. You will end up with the same results. You don't need to fill the sump with 2/3 or 70% of water, you will need a sump VERY large to compensate for that during a pump shut down. The whole point of a w/d is to allow as much media as possible to be exposed to air. The water will create a layer on the media and with its adhesion properties, will follow the media down for the most part exposing its self to lots of air. Keeping 70% of the media under water will defeat the purpose.