The Hypocrite thread mbu

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I'd put it in a 250G.

If you go to the source - the puffer forum, the tank size for a Mappa puffer is 250G while they get to around the same size as Mbus. From my research they display similar activity levels as well.

Speaking of hypocrisy, it would be nice if the leader of the puffer advocates 'pufferpunk' would lead by example and put her fahaka into a bigger tank. Stuffing a fish that gets to 18" into a 18" width tank has no doubt stunted her fish, and she has mentioned she can't afford an upgrade.. She should give the fish a better home by letting someone who can give it a bigger tank - as pufferpunk herself would say.
 
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i pee in the sea said:
Speaking of hypocrisy, it would be nice if the leader of the puffer advocates 'pufferpunk' would lead by example and put her fahaka into a bigger tank. Stuffing a fish that gets to 18" into a 18" width tank has no doubt stunted her fish, and she has mentioned she can't afford an upgrade.. She should give the fish a better home by letting someone who can give it a bigger tank - as pufferpunk herself would say.
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Hypocrites, sadly, rarely follow their own advice.
 
Andrex said:
Ive noticed all the "1000g clan" has cleared off now, we have made too many points about why they do NOT need 1000g.
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I would say given up to be more exact...i mean in all honesty, people will do what they want with their fish regardless of what others tell them, i mean at the end of the day, i think i would be better off talking to brick wall then trying to argue with people on this section of the forum, which is exactly why i leave my comment and thats the end of it, either you take it or leave it...

either way no skin off my back...

Just my 0.2 cents
 
Some of you reiterate an absurd logic of putting a Mbu in a 1000G and the others keep proving it wrong.

It seems more like a defeat to me from the sidelines.

Just because some puffer 'scientists' (one of them who can't even follow her own husbandry requirements) say one thing, doesn't make it seem to be the absolute truth.

Use your own head people, you have it for a reason.
 
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^ Okay, just for the record, the reason why i personally think an MBU should have at least 800G is because as i have said before, i find a 200G for my Fahaka to be still a tad small... would much rather have it in a 300G+ if possible... so an MBU for me in an 800G sounds about right...

Anyway, as i said, thats just my thoughts, my personal beliefs regardless of what any scientist or in this case puffer punk says...

And as always, not trying to argue, just stating my personal views...
 
Fat Homer said:
^ Okay, just for the record, the reason why i personally think an MBU should have at least 800G is because as i have said before, i find a 200G for my Fahaka to be still a tad small... would much rather have it in a 300G+ if possible... so an MBU for me in an 800G sounds about right...

Anyway, as i said, thats just my thoughts, my personal beliefs regardless of what any scientist or in this case puffer punk says...

And as always, not trying to argue, just stating my personal views...
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A exta 500g for an extra 6-7inchs of fish? dont know how that sounds about right.
 
Wow, I'm surprised that this thread is still going.

Just to clarify a few things .......

While I have always agreed that a single Mbu does not require a 1,000 gallon tank, some of the comments in this discussion defy logic, such as a 24" fish with a massive girth that eats like a horse, can get by on very VERY minimal water changes when housed in a 180 gallon tank. That's just plain ignorant, and totally absurd.

Most of the waste produced by a fish isn't in a solid form that you can see with the naked eye, and bio-load does not just equate to how much crap is produced by a fish. One of the leading causes of cataracts in aquarium fish is bacterial based, often caused from poor water quality, so that certainly leaves your comment about this fishes living conditions having no effect on its health & overall condition open for debate. The reality is you have no idea whether the conditions that you have kept that fish in have been the direct cause of any health issues. I'm not saying that it has, I'm just sayin ......

From a previous post of mine in this thread;

Your logic of thinking that modern filtration (canisters & HOB filters) is going to add a big plus to the equation also shows how little you understand about water quality, and bio load.
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You still seem to be under the misguided notion that massive filtration equates to pristine water quality ..... it doesn't! Pristine water quality comes from massive water export & import, NOT massive filtration.

The link that you posted of the arrowana community tank was from a link that I supplied, but with regards to bio-load that set up is nothing like yours. That tank is owned by a friend of mine who has all of his large comm tanks, including that one, on an auto drip system which allows him to dial up or down the water changes depending on the tanks bio-load. That tank that you linked to was at that time receiving 100+ gallons of fresh water on a daily basis, in order to keep the nitrate levels below 10ppm, and in order to keep all water parameters at a constant level. His fishroom has between 400-500 gallons of fresh water coming in every single day. That's a huge difference from someone doing minimal water changes, as though that's something to be boasting about. This person has learned from hands on experience with massive fish and massive appetites (and past mistakes) as to how water quality can effect a fishes growth & overall health in a positive, and/or negative manner.



I have absolutely no problem with those that feel they can supply an adult Mbu healthy long term conditions in tanks under 1,000 gallons, but to argue that this can be done with an adult mbu in a 180 gallon tank, with minimal water changes, is just plain piss poor advice.

I only came back to this discussion & post this in the hopes that someone that's new to this species doesn't get any ideas that this type of set up is in any way ideal for the fish, because it won't be.


Carry on ........
 
RD. said:
Wow, I'm surprised that this thread is still going.

Just to clarify a few things .......

While I have always agreed that a single Mbu does not require a 1,000 gallon tank, some of the comments in this discussion defy logic, such as a 24" fish with a massive girth that eats like a horse, can get by on very VERY minimal water changes when housed in a 180 gallon tank. That's just plain ignorant, and totally absurd.

Most of the waste produced by a fish isn't in a solid form that you can see with the naked eye, and bio-load does not just equate to how much crap is produced by a fish. One of the leading causes of cataracts in aquarium fish is bacterial based, often caused from poor water quality, so that certainly leaves your comment about this fishes living conditions having no effect on its health & overall condition open for debate. The reality is you have no idea whether the conditions that you have kept that fish in have been the direct cause of any health issues. I'm not saying that it has, I'm just sayin ......

From a previous post of mine in this thread;



You still seem to be under the misguided notion that massive filtration equates to pristine water quality ..... it doesn't! Pristine water quality comes from massive water export & import, NOT massive filtration.

The link that you posted of the arrowana community tank was from a link that I supplied, but with regards to bio-load that set up is nothing like yours. That tank is owned by a friend of mine who has all of his large comm tanks, including that one, on an auto drip system which allows him to dial up or down the water changes depending on the tanks bio-load. That tank that you linked to was at that time receiving 100+ gallons of fresh water on a daily basis, in order to keep the nitrate levels below 10ppm, and in order to keep all water parameters at a constant level. His fishroom has between 400-500 gallons of fresh water coming in every single day. That's a huge difference from someone doing minimal water changes, as though that's something to be boasting about. This person has learned from hands on experience with massive fish and massive appetites (and past mistakes) as to how water quality can effect a fishes growth & overall health in a positive, and/or negative manner.



I have absolutely no problem with those that feel they can supply an adult Mbu healthy long term conditions in tanks under 1,000 gallons, but to argue that this can be done with an adult mbu in a 180 gallon tank, with minimal water changes, is just plain piss poor advice.

I only came back to this discussion & post this in the hopes that someone that's new to this species doesn't get any ideas that this type of set up is in any way ideal for the fish, because it won't be.


Carry on ........
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So what you are saying is what Im doing is wrong with have an MBU in a 180 but its perfectly ok to have many arros in a tank that are much larger than my MBU because it has daily water changes? So if I had a drip system in my 180 with the MBU then I would be just fine correct?

Im not sure if its called a cataract, he had it in one eye before I got him, its not cloudy, but gold right in the center of his eye, now its in the other and he does have a harder time finding food but eventually he does. ITs on the inside, not the outside. I have noticed here lately that when I turn the lights off, he goes crazy, when they come on he calms down, never done that before but he is in a 265 now so maybe thats why, not sure yet.

No matter what you say, others and myself have kept these fish in much smaller tanks than is recommended and the fish have lived successfully, my MBU included. Untill my fish start passing because of my so called poor water management, I will continue to keep my fish how I please, and I plan to keep my MBU in the 265 for sometime now. Dont just pick on the MBU, there are many other fish out there that need larger tanks than what they are in but for some reason you dont seem to find the same discussions going on over there now do you? Why is the MBU different than other fish? Certainly the a 24" MBU doesnt eat more than a 24" RTC but yet nothing is being said about that and MANY other fish........
 
With the exception of one fish, all of those aros in that link were around the same size in length as your mbu, but that's in a 550 gallon tank, with MUCH larger dimensions than a standard 180. So no, you are not correct in your assumption.

While I realize what yourself & some others have done, that doesn't equate to it being a success story, any more than it is when some jackass reports how they have kept a 12" adult midas or red devil for years in a 30L tank (36x12x17) with very VERY minimal water changes.

No one is arguing about what can be done, obviously one can cram a large fish into a small tank, even for its entire life & call it a success story. And Mbu aren't different than any other fish, go into the CA/SA section & brag about keeping an adult A. labiatus or citrinellum in a 30 gallon tank for years & the MFK members in that section will hand you your ass. These exact same types of discussions do in fact take place in other sections of this site.

I realize that there are a LOT of MFK members that are keeping fish that they have no business keeping, in tanks far too small for the fish, but two wrongs don't make a right.

Either way I'm glad to hear that your Mbu has been upgraded to a 265.
 
RD. said:
With the exception of one fish, all of those aros in that link were around the same size in length as your mbu, but that's in a 550 gallon tank, with MUCH larger dimensions than a standard 180. So no, you are not correct in your assumption.

While I realize what yourself & some others have done, that doesn't equate to it being a success story, any more than it is when some jackass reports how they have kept a 12" adult midas or red devil for years in a 30L tank (36x12x17) with very VERY minimal water changes.

No one is arguing about what can be done, obviously one can cram a large fish into a small tank, even for its entire life & call it a success story. And Mbu aren't different than any other fish, go into the CA/SA section & brag about keeping an adult A. labiatus or citrinellum in a 30 gallon tank for years & the MFK members in that section will hand you your ass. These exact same types of discussions do in fact take place in other sections of this site.

I realize that there are a LOT of MFK members that are keeping fish that they have no business keeping, in tanks far too small for the fish, but two wrongs don't make a right.

Either way I'm glad to hear that your Mbu has been upgraded to a 265.
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But the 265 is still only 24" wide....
 
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