This aint good

[Pomatomus]

I agree completely! I would like someone to name a single species brought near to extinction solely due to an introduced invasive species in Florida. Most natives being pushed to extinction were already heading that way due to habitat destruction and pollution, both due to human encroachment. The invasive species may be taking a toll, but its just a pinhead added on to the impact humans are having.

Florida invasives haven't been around that long. Their populations could boom in certain environmental conditions, gaining a foothold we can't even fathom. Even though extinction is an extreme and rare result (except Lake Victoria), it becomes more likely as exotic occupation continues.

As for humans impacting the environment, it's true we do much worse. But I challenge you to propose limiting our population. That's an artifact of utopian thinking. It's not feasible, while limiting certain species is. If I could take away all of our technology with the press of a button, I would; but I asked politicians for permission it wouldn't fly.

 

[davo]

that poor little girl

forgive me for saying this but at least fish don't eat children

I have a corn snake, and have had other snakes , but, I just do not see the reason to own a snake that can kill a human being.

Indeed it is sad. I don't know what your feelings are on other pets, but stuff like horses and dogs... people are killed by these too on occasion, although I understand the animals are not exactly comparible. You see a lot of hypocrisy over here too, reptiles are not as socially accepted as other animals. I dunno about florida, but over here cats are a massive problem to our native species. Bet we won't see motions to get them banned any time soon.

From what I know about florida ecosystems, it's all well and good them banning them for ecological reasons but unless they are prepared to undo all the other problems the state has brought on itself, it's not much of a step forward. From the outside it looks like florida is facing a mountain.

Anyone know if they kill the non natives when they are found? I presume they do?

 

[coreyweinkoetz]

QUOTE]
I leave this thread with a protest to the irony of the FFWCC's actions. Below is a picture that some of you may have seen before containing the 2 snakes that were released (by order of a game officer).

[/QUOTE]

NOT ONLY ARE THEY NOT KILLED BUT TWO YEARS AGO I WAS ON A TWO WEEK R+R trip at glades Nat.park and having a talk with a fish and wildlife officer about a huge eastern Dback we photographed and I told him I was there almost two weeks of deep herping and found not one Python or boa and he told me if I did see one not to harass it .

 

[Conner]

Florida invasives haven't been around that long. Their populations could boom in certain environmental conditions, gaining a foothold we can't even fathom. Even though extinction is an extreme and rare result (except Lake Victoria), it becomes more likely as exotic occupation continues.

As for humans impacting the environment, it's true we do much worse. But I challenge you to propose limiting our population. That's an artifact of utopian thinking. It's not feasible, while limiting certain species is. If I could take away all of our technology with the press of a button, I would; but I asked politicians for permission it wouldn't fly.

I agree that non-natives can and do gain a foothold, but I don't think they have the kind of impact on native species that most people seem to think they do. Especially compared to the human impact on those same species.

As far as limiting the population, I agree, it will never happen. And unfortunately it seems like its the less educated, less caring, more likely to disregard the law people who seem to do the majority of the reproducing in this country...

 

[ski's_reef]

Just a few quick thoughts...

Florida's FWC is a joke. Im not usually one to insult but let me explain... Ive had several encounters with them and have been surprised at their general lack of knowledge every time. While seining in the Indian River Lagoon for a university research project FFWC received an anonymous call about a group of "mexicans" illegally gill netting. It just so happened that it was me and several other students, permitted through the school for research purposes, were the "offenders". As the FWC officers proceeded to check our nets and buckets one of them stopped to question me about some juvenile "flounder" I had in my bucket. These were actually Hogchokers Trinectes murinus and not flounder! I proceeded to argue the point with him and he eventually relented and we were allowed to go without consequence.

On another occasion I watched a FFWC officer inspect a man's bucket of animals he had collected from the Keys which included illegally collected Carribean stony corals and allow him to keep everything!

On yet another occasion I saw a FFWC officer go into a LFS and confiscate a Yellow Stingray Urolophis jamaicensis from their saltwater section because it was clearly (in his mind) an illegal FW Potamotrygon sp. WTF?

The point of these 3 stories is that on neither occasion did the officer seem to actually know anything about the species under his jurisdiction... It makes me wonder how qualified one needs to be to obtain this job. It just doesnt make sense to me.

Also I dont know if its different in the national parks but it was my understanding that under Florida law no special permission or permits are needed to collect invasive species except in certain situations like the transportation of Tilapia etc. I was also under the impression that those same laws made it illegal to rerelease collected invasives... So wouldnt that mean that by asking you to rerelease those Burms he was essentially telling you to break the law? Sorry that just didnt make sense to me.

I have a few more points to make but dont have time at the moment... More to come later!

Ski

 

[Pomatomus]

I have had no experience with the law enforcement part of FFWC, but I collaborated with a knowledgeable member of their invasive fish laboratory in Boca Raton when I discovered a new population of invasive fish.

I'm also not sure about national parks, but I know state parks do require their own permit which requires lots of processing time.

 

[Louie]

Indeed it is sad. I don't know what your feelings are on other pets, but stuff like horses and dogs... people are killed by these too on occasion, although I understand the animals are not exactly comparible. You see a lot of hypocrisy over here too, reptiles are not as socially accepted as other animals. I dunno about florida, but over here cats are a massive problem to our native species. Bet we won't see motions to get them banned any time soon.

From what I know about florida ecosystems, it's all well and good them banning them for ecological reasons but unless they are prepared to undo all the other problems the state has brought on itself, it's not much of a step forward. From the outside it looks like florida is facing a mountain.

Anyone know if they kill the non natives when they are found? I presume they do?

I do know the state kills lots of natives whether construction or in my area individuals who kill ever corn ,garter,etc in their yard with shovels. Never mind any snake "foolish" enough to cross a golf course even catch and remove trappers kill .

The invasives will one day be the only animals left here the rate the state is going .

"Actually, rattlesnakes that size were commonplace, she said.
"It's another victim of development because a lot of people just don't like snakes," Hill said. "They sure don't want a rattlesnake around their house."

http://jacksonville.com/news/metro/2009-10-01/story/huge_rattlesnake_found_near_st_augustine

 

[krzr3000]

I do know the state kills lots of natives whether construction or in my area individuals who kill ever corn ,garter,etc in their yard with shovels. Never mind any snake "foolish" enough to cross a golf course even catch and remove trappers kill .

The invasives will one day be the only animals left here the rate the state is going .

"Actually, rattlesnakes that size were commonplace, she said.
"It's another victim of development because a lot of people just don't like snakes," Hill said. "They sure don't want a rattlesnake around their house."

http://jacksonville.com/news/metro/2009-10-01/story/huge_rattlesnake_found_near_st_augustine

"Even Booth. "I was always brought up that the only good poisonous snake is a dead poisonous snake," he said."


What an idiot, he shouldn't consider himself a "trapper" if thats his mentality. Amazing that so many people knowingly live and accept to live somewhere where dangerous animals have always been. But seem surprised when they come across them. ****ing leeches

 

[Louie]

Florida invasives haven't been around that long. Their populations could boom in certain environmental conditions, gaining a foothold we can't even fathom. Even though extinction is an extreme and rare result (except Lake Victoria), it becomes more likely as exotic occupation continues.

As for humans impacting the environment, it's true we do much worse. But I challenge you to propose limiting our population. That's an artifact of utopian thinking. It's not feasible, while limiting certain species is. If I could take away all of our technology with the press of a button, I would; but I asked politicians for permission it wouldn't fly.

"Florida invasives haven't been around that long."


With the Caribbean being a skip away and boats going back and forth for hundredS of yrs bringing cargo such as tree's ,fruit,etc the small one's have probably been here hundredS of yrs.


Many of the palm tree's in Miami are not native to Florida they were initially bought in from the Caribbeans . There is no way they didn't come hundreds of yrs ago.

The common Florida Cuban royal palm (Roystonea regia) was imported in numbers during 1900 to 1910 .
You can rest assured loaded with Carribean natives and thats just one plant imorted "recently" again fruit,etc shipments BEFORE that bought them here.


It is unreal to think they did not. With the growing development you see them more and again they fill a niche that smaller natives could no longer thrive in.

 

[krichardson]

People are not exactly sure how many of these pythons there are but we know there are a bunch and we know that we want them gone. I have been down to the glades and I have caught a pair of these pythons before. During that trip, myself in addition to everyone I was with were told that even if we caught these horrible invasives, we were not allowed to keep, sell, trade, or even kill them and that no wildlife was to be removed from the area w/o a further permits. We HAD gotten permission to go herping so long as we released everything that we found where we found it but we had also planned to keep any invasive snakes we found to bring them farther north (where they could not survive) for a profit. The irony of it being that the FFWCC does not want the snakes in the park but they will not allow for them to be removed from the park either.




I leave this thread with a protest to the irony of the FFWCC's actions. Below is a picture that some of you may have seen before containing the 2 snakes that were released (by order of a game officer).

View attachment 472795

Very interesting and disturbing,kind of makes me wonder just what the FWCC has in store for these snakes if they dont want them to be removed.These non native snakes are the main target of the proposed bill yet they have sanctuary.