To many floting Particles

[Oughtsix]

Have you ever seen this filter. Seems to good to be true. More Surface area for less money. But it only takes 3 pounds of DE and the hayward takes 4. That's what I don't get how can one be 20 sqft and take 4 pounds and one be 100 sqft and take 4? Because of the turnover rate I need I want the most Surface area

I don't understand your question. The thread I directed you to is my thread.

I chose the Hayward EC40 because it has the handle to knock the DE off the filter screens (they are actually tube shaped screens) and it is the shortest DE filter in the series. I built my stand so that it was tall enough for the EC40 to fit under the stand. Some day I will make doors for my stand so it hides all of my beautiful plumbing work... and the sump + EC40.

About once a week I shut the pump off, actuate the handle on the EC40 several times to knock the DE powder off then turn the pump back on to recoat the screens with the DE that was just knocked off. When I turn the EC40 back on a very small bloom of DE goes into me tank. The bloom is so small I don't worry about switching the 2 way valve to pass the water directly back to the sump.

I can run the EC40 with my Jeboa 20,000 pump full on at 100% if I want to. I will run it 100% for a bit and stir up my tank to get the food and poop into the water stream. Normally I run the Jebao at 60% which give me plenty of circulation in my tank. After about a week the DE gets plugged up with detritus slowing the water flow at which time I turn off the pump, knock off the DE and turn the pump back on as described above.

When starting up my 180 I never got the usual bacteria bloom. I also never got the usual green water bloom that I usually get with a dirt bottom planted tank. The DE does a good job of clearing these out of the water stream before they are ever noticeable.

Does that answer your question?

 

[Oughtsix]

This is what the screens on the Hayward EC40 look like. There are other DE pool filters with MUCH bigger screens but they don't have the bump handle to knock the DE off the screens for a quick recycling of the DE.

 

[Tj203]

I don't understand your question. The thread I directed you to is my thread.

I chose the Hayward EC40 because it has the handle to knock the DE off the filter screens (they are actually tube shaped screens) and it is the shortest DE filter in the series. I built my stand so that it was tall enough for the EC40 to fit under the stand. Some day I will make door for my stand so it hides all of my beautiful plumbing work... and the sump.

About once a week I shut the pump off, actuate the handle on the EC40 several times to knock the DE powder off then turn the pump back on to recoat the screens with the DE that was just knocked off. When I turn the EC40 back on a very small plomb of DE goes into me tank. The plumb is so small I don't worry about switching the 2 way valve to pass the water directly back to the sump.

I can run the EC40 with my Jeboa 20,000 pump full on at 100% if I want to. I will run it 100% for a bit and stir up my tank to get the food and poop into the water stream. Normally I run the Jebao at 60% which give me plenty of circulation in my tank. After about a week the DE gets plugged up with detritus slowing the water flow at which time I turn off the pump, knock off the DE and turn the pump back on as described above.

When starting up my 180 I never got the usual bacteria bloom. I also never got the usual green water bloom that I usually get with a dirt bottom planted tank. The DE does a good job of clearing these out of the water stream before they are ever noticeable.

Does that answer your question?

De filter are rated by sqft. The ec40 clames it has 20 sqft and takes 4 pounds of DE and cost $350.
The rx clear claims 100 sqft but only takes 3 pounds of DE and cost $230. The more sqft of filter area you have the more flow you can run through it. I think it was 2gpm per sqft. So with the size of my tank I would want the filter with the most sqft so I can up the flow rate. But these numbers seem to good to be true so I was wondering if you have heard or tried the rx clear one as I would rather use that because of the price especially if the specs are correct

Amazon.com : Rx Clear DE Element Filter Tank 100 Sq. Ft. | Includes DE Element Cartridge | Easy to Clean : Patio, Lawn & Garden

Amazon.com : Rx Clear DE Element Filter Tank 100 Sq. Ft. | Includes DE Element Cartridge | Easy to Clean : Patio, Lawn & Garden

www.amazon.com

 

[Oughtsix]

De filter are rated by sqft. The ec40 clames it has 20 sqft and takes 4 pounds of DE and cost $350.
The rx clear claims 100 sqft but only takes 3 pounds of DE and cost $230. The more sqft of filter area you have the more flow you can run through it. I think it was 2gpm per sqft. So with the size of my tank I would want the filter with the most sqft so I can up the flow rate. But these numbers seem to good to be true so I was wondering if you have heard or tried the rx clear one as I would rather use that because of the price especially if the specs are correct

Amazon.com : Rx Clear DE Element Filter Tank 100 Sq. Ft. | Includes DE Element Cartridge | Easy to Clean : Patio, Lawn & Garden

Amazon.com : Rx Clear DE Element Filter Tank 100 Sq. Ft. | Includes DE Element Cartridge | Easy to Clean : Patio, Lawn & Garden

www.amazon.com

Ahhh.... I am with you now. The RX Clear is 42" tall which would not fit under my stand. It also doesn't have the bump handle to knock off the DE. My guess it the EC40 takes as much DE as the RX Clear due to its ability to knock the DE off the screens and recoat them (I will call this "regenerating").

BUT, I can definitely see how the RX clear would make a lot of sense to a lot of people. I have never come across the RX Clear before and I did a lot of research on DE filters... ~10 years ago, so I am going to guess it is a newer model. Many of the DE filters I looked at 10 years ago were like the EC40 but upside down. The bases had the screens mounted on them and the whole top would come off leaving the screens exposed AND dumping all the water all over the floor... which looked like a huge mess to me. The RX Clear looks like it has a removable top that will still keep the screens and the water around them contained. That, to me, looks like a very nice enhancement over the other non Hayward EC diatomaceous earth filters I have looked at.

I got a good deal on my EC40 10 years ago and I picked up a spare off ebay (new with no box) for ~$100+ (one hundred and something). I am definitely prejudice in my preference of the EC40, owning 2 of them.

A DE filter with a 100 Sq. Ft. of screen area... seems logical it would last 5 times longer than the EC40 before it clogs. That could balance out the regenerating without recharging capability of the EC filters. For the price difference I can see how someone would be tempted to try the RX Clear! If you or someone else does try the RX Clear please post your feed back... preferable in my DE thread if you don't mind. If it works out nicely I would think many others might see it as a tempting alternative at a much better price. Hayward does make larger EC models but the prices go up rather steeply for the larger models.

A Note: One of the advantages of DE filters is that the actual filtering surface area is many times the surface area of the screens the DE is clinging to due to the properties of the diatom shells.

P.S. I should have been a bit more descriptive in my method for cleaning and recharging the EC40. I disconnect the filter from my sump and tank plumbing then carry it to the kitchen sink where I open the drain plug to let the filter completely drain of water before taking it outside to separate the top from the bottom and spray it off with the hose.

I am a fan of DE filters (I started with a little Diatom XL aquarium specific water polishing filter) and stopped looking when I found a solution for a full time DE filter that suits me and my aquarium setups. I would really like to hear the feed back of others (good or [hopefully not] bad). Perfectly clear/transparent water is something that I really take for granted these days. I think others would really appreciate this too! I think increasing the knowledge base about all DE filters might encourage others to give DE filters a try.

P.P.S. I really shouldn't tempt fait by saying this but I haven't had any disease out breaks in any of my DE equipped aquariums in the past 10 years.

 

[Oughtsix]

The ec40 clames it has 20 sqft

I wish I could edit my older post to correct my statement the the EC40 has 40 Sq. Ft. of screen area. You are completely correct that the EC40 only has 20 Sq. Ft. of screen area! I hate putting out mis-information... I should have checked the specs before posting.

 

[jjohnwm]

I have been looking around for an EC40 since first seeing Oughtsix post about it, without luck. This new RX Clear looks interesting, but without the cool little "bump" handle I wonder how often you would be back-flushing and therefore changing DE in it?

If you could get a month or more out of a charge of DE, and if it is as easy to clean as the Amazon ad suggests, it might be worthwhile. Backflushing sounds like it is much easier than dismantling the EC40 for a powder change, and the idea of brand new clean powder has some appeal versus just shaking the old crap-laden powder off with the bump handle, and then re-coating it back onto the screens. In fact, if you do your plumbing right, it seems like a backflush on the RX Clear would be not much more work than operating the bump handle on the EC40.

I miss my old Vortex diatom filter. And I really, really want a new, updated version for constant use, rather than just the odd water-polishing session. T Tj203 , if you get one of these DE filters...any one of them...your water clarity issues will vanish within an hour or two. You will love it. It's just a matter of comparing features, price, etc. and making a choice.

 

[Oughtsix]

the idea of brand new clean powder has some appeal versus just shaking the old crap-laden powder off with the bump handle, and then re-coating it back onto the screens.

I completely agree that taking the detritus out of the water column is MUCH better than keeping it in the filter for several month to break down into nitrogen compounds!

It kind of sounds like the RX Clear is a cartridge filter repurposed as a DE filter... not necessary a bad thing. This might make maintenance much easier.

When I open up my EC40 big solid looking chunks of DE fall off the filter screens. I would guess this might also happen when removing the filter cartridge from the RX Clear possibly making clean out a bit more work than just pulling out the cartridge and washing it off.

"BACKWASHING IS A BREEZE - When the pressure gauge on your DE filter is reading 8 to 10 lbs above your starting pressure, backwashing the filter to remove the dirt is an easy step. Just move the filter valve to backwash your DE filter and discharge the dirty filter powder. DE filter powder is not included."

This DOES sound VERY convenient and much easier!

 

[jjohnwm]

This thread put the bug in my ear...again!...and I once more went on a DE filter search online, without results. The single Canuck source for the RX Clear is...surprise, surprise...out of stock, no indication of if/when they will be available.

So...how about this: there are a number of makers of filter housings (for domestic well water and other applications) that accept standard 4.5-inch-diameter pleated cartridges, which can be had as fine as 1 micron. These cartridges fit into a cylindrical body that is simply screwed into a headpiece which contains both inlet and outlet. Some incorporate shut-off valves and/or bypasses to ease cartridge changes; others are simpler but could be plumbed into a system with shutoff valves before and after the filter. They can be had in clear plastic so you can see what's going on inside.

One micron is plenty small enough to catch and hold diatom powder, so all it would take is a charge of powder, probably a few tablespoons, and you would have...I think...a reasonably capable continuous-use DE filter that would be very compact (compared to the other options discussed here) and still fairly easy and inexpensive to re-charge as needed. With decent pre-filtration I expect it would give at least a month or so of useful life. I suspect that it would have limited flow rate capacities, but a quick perusal of some manufacturers literature seems to indicate that 1 micron cartridges can operate at up to 15 gallons per minute, so just under 1000gph. While this may not sound sufficient for aquarists who want their tanks to look like a Maytag washer on the Heavy Clean cycle, this would be enough to give the benefits of DE filtration as long as other filters remain in use as well.

Considering that the old Vortex Diatom filter would turn a murky, just-stirred-up 360 gallon tank literally crystal clear within an hour or two, with a paltry 200 or 300 gph flow rate, this might be the solution for some of us who want to experiment with DE without spending hundreds of dollars and completely re-doing their filtration systems. A filter like this could be easily added to an existing filtration system, using a Tee fitting and a couple of valves to divert enough flow through the DE filter to get it to work while sending the rest of the pump output directly to the tank. Or, as an alternate, it could be completely independent of your existing system, running off its own pump and hopefully its own pre-filter. I'm thinking I want to try this, and I suspect that in my case I will simply use a separate, independent pump to move the water out of the last stage of my sump (i.e. after it has already gone through my existing mechanical and biological filtration media), through the DE filter, and then back into the sump. The actual flow rate through my aquarium will remain unchanged, but the water will still be micron-filtered, crystal-clear, parasite-free and beautiful.

Once I get the bugs worked out of it, then I could plumb it permanently into the system as the final stage of filtration before returning the water to the tank directly.

 

[Tj203]

We I just bought an open box one of these. $280 The rx just seems to good to be true this one has 36sqft and takes 6 pounds of DE. There is no way the rx one is 100 sqft . I will post my results to that post.

Sta-Rite PLDE36 System:2 Modular D.E. PLDE Series Pool Filter, 36 Square Feet, 3 | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Sta-Rite PLDE36 System:2 Modular D.E. PLDE Series Pool Filter, 36 Square Feet, 3 at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!

www.ebay.com

 

[Oughtsix]

This thread put the bug in my ear...again!...and I once more went on a DE filter search online, without results. The single Canuck source for the RX Clear is...surprise, surprise...out of stock, no indication of if/when they will be available.

So...how about this: there are a number of makers of filter housings (for domestic well water and other applications) that accept standard 4.5-inch-diameter pleated cartridges, which can be had as fine as 1 micron. These cartridges fit into a cylindrical body that is simply screwed into a headpiece which contains both inlet and outlet. Some incorporate shut-off valves and/or bypasses to ease cartridge changes; others are simpler but could be plumbed into a system with shutoff valves before and after the filter. They can be had in clear plastic so you can see what's going on inside.

One micron is plenty small enough to catch and hold diatom powder, so all it would take is a charge of powder, probably a few tablespoons, and you would have...I think...a reasonably capable continuous-use DE filter that would be very compact (compared to the other options discussed here) and still fairly easy and inexpensive to re-charge as needed. With decent pre-filtration I expect it would give at least a month or so of useful life. I suspect that it would have limited flow rate capacities, but a quick perusal of some manufacturers literature seems to indicate that 1 micron cartridges can operate at up to 15 gallons per minute, so just under 1000gph. While this may not sound sufficient for aquarists who want their tanks to look like a Maytag washer on the Heavy Clean cycle, this would be enough to give the benefits of DE filtration as long as other filters remain in use as well.

Considering that the old Vortex Diatom filter would turn a murky, just-stirred-up 360 gallon tank literally crystal clear within an hour or two, with a paltry 200 or 300 gph flow rate, this might be the solution for some of us who want to experiment with DE without spending hundreds of dollars and completely re-doing their filtration systems. A filter like this could be easily added to an existing filtration system, using a Tee fitting and a couple of valves to divert enough flow through the DE filter to get it to work while sending the rest of the pump output directly to the tank. Or, as an alternate, it could be completely independent of your existing system, running off its own pump and hopefully its own pre-filter. I'm thinking I want to try this, and I suspect that in my case I will simply use a separate, independent pump to move the water out of the last stage of my sump (i.e. after it has already gone through my existing mechanical and biological filtration media), through the DE filter, and then back into the sump. The actual flow rate through my aquarium will remain unchanged, but the water will still be micron-filtered, crystal-clear, parasite-free and beautiful.

Once I get the bugs worked out of it, then I could plumb it permanently into the system as the final stage of filtration before returning the water to the tank directly.

One of the companies that make those cartridge filters calls them "Big Blue" filters. I have some experience using these with DE. I have to go to bed now but I will fill in what I found with these cartridge filters when I get a chance tomorrow. If you don't mind I will quote your post above into the Monster DE thread.