Dogs are not for everyone. Speaking from experience. Back in 1989 I thought it would be cool to own a dog. Less then 2 years later it proved too much for me to handle and I took the dog to the pound. I haven't had a dog since.
Another dog biting story
- Thread starter Warborg
- Start date
Yes, the parents definitely need to be put down. Barring that, at least arrest them for child endangerment and criminal neglect. Why they haven't been is beyond me.
Hello; This reads as a very strong indictment against owning dogs in general. The parents did what many do, which is to get a dog for a pet. What they did not do is watch over the dog and child. It is not clear to me just how the child was up alone with the dog. Maybe the child wandered off? It would seem from your post that any time a child is bitten a capital case could be made against the parents/owner of a dog.
This could also be extended to the shelter operators. It is my understanding the shelter gave some sort of warning about the dog. This could imply prior knowledge about the nature of the dog.
While there was possibly some sort of negligence by people involved, capital punishment for the pet owners seems extreme. Much would depend on intent.
I do, however, agree with you that the dog should be put down.
No, I disagree very much ... there is no way that dog should be put down. Read the story again. While yes, some blame would go to the shelter for not removing the dog when the parents decided to be stupid, but the majority of the blame here is clearly with the parents. The fact the a dog might lose it's life due to the abject stupidity of the parents is a crime. If it was an unprovoked attack, then sure. But that isn't the case here.
Have my dogs in the past allowed kids to beat on them without responding? Yes, but it takes a lot of training to get to that point. Expecting a shelter dog to have that level of training is unreasonable, considering most dogs end up there because their previous owners had no clue on how to properly own a dog.
Edit: Yes, most of the time the fault lies with the owner of the dog. Like a car, I believe people should have to have a license to own a dog (or a computer or child). While a lot of people have dogs in their household, most are not dog owners because they have no fraking clue what it takes to properly own, care, and train a dog.
I love dogs, but I don't currently have the time to properly care or train one at this point in my life, thus I don't own one. Like Warborg said, they aren't for everyone.
Have my dogs in the past allowed kids to beat on them without responding? Yes, but it takes a lot of training to get to that point. Expecting a shelter dog to have that level of training is unreasonable, considering most dogs end up there because their previous owners had no clue on how to properly own a dog.
Edit: Yes, most of the time the fault lies with the owner of the dog. Like a car, I believe people should have to have a license to own a dog (or a computer or child). While a lot of people have dogs in their household, most are not dog owners because they have no fraking clue what it takes to properly own, care, and train a dog.
I love dogs, but I don't currently have the time to properly care or train one at this point in my life, thus I don't own one. Like Warborg said, they aren't for everyone.
Hello; I read thru the link more carefully. The parents and shelter people have different versions with regard to the "warning" about letting the dog and child interact. I suppose the implication could be that the shelter warning was a general warning and not about the specific dog. This might imply the shelter warning is a CYA type arning. Although not clear by the wording, the parents seem to claim no warning was given. He said -she said.
What seems apparent is the child hugged and "shook" the dog. I am unsure what this shaking by a two year old is meant to imply. At least I saw no statement that the child had hurt the dog. The child apparently went toward the dog again and the dog bit. There is a video of the event that is not yet released. The parents were apparently in the enclosure with the dogs and the child. Not clear where the shelter people were.
It makes sense that a family wishing to adopt a dog would interact with the dogs. I have not done a shelter visit, perhaps someone who has such an experience can comment on what is common. The video would likely clear things up some. So far from the information available it does not seem the actions of the child would warrant a bite from the dog as happened.
The dog is a bitter.
Well I have, and you certainly do not let a child go up to a dog alone, especially one that young. You also don't let the child do anything more than gently pet the dog either. Typically the child is kept in your arms, so that if they are too young (as this one was) and starts doing anything wrong (or the dog does), you can easily stand so the child is out of range of the dog.
Hello; Thanks for clearing up your stance. I did not interpert your previous post correctly. I understand now that you are for having the parents "put down" but for allowing the dog to live. So yes , we disagree on a very fundamental level. I place people well above any consideration of a dog. From my point of view that is wrong thinking.
As I stated most recently after reading thru the link again. I do see the attack by the dog as basically unprovoked by the child. The child was not reported to have been hurting the dog. Not poking with a stick. Not sticking fingers in it's eyes. Not kicking the dog. The child hugged the dog and apparently rocked side to side. I have seen small children do this sort of hugging. If the hugging and "shaking" off a two year old child meets your standard of justification of provocation for an attack by a dog, then we have yet another very different difference of opinion. The dog is a bitter and needs be put down.
I don't believe the life of a dog should be put down based on the people being stupid. Nor do I think people should have special privileges above other animals, especially with how cruel humans typically are. Dogs are far more trustworthy than anyone I would meet on the street in this day and age.
Yes, I've seen that kind of hugging before and if it had happened in my house with my dog, I would blame myself. This was in a shelter. Dogs in shelters are not in a good place. They are scared and nervous. The same behavior a well trained dog would endure in a home is not the same type of behavior they will accept in a strange place with strange people when they are scared. If you don't know and acknowledge the difference, then you shouldn't own a dog (as the child's parents clearly shouldn't ... ever).
An example: Last night someone came into our store with their dog. This is a very calm dog that I have petted many times before. However, when I closed the metal gates to close up the store, the dog didn't like the loud noise at all. He was shaking, put himself in front of his owner, and flattened his ears. Despite wagging his tail, those danger signs meant I would not try to reach down and pet him at that time. That could possible provoke a reaction. And it would be fully justified in my experience. If I had done that and got bit, I certainly wouldn't have blamed the dog. It would have been my own damn fault for not paying attention to the warning signs.
I'm not going to try to hug a mugger threatening me with a knife, I'm sure as heck not going to try and pet a dog showing warning signs to stay away.
Yes, I've seen that kind of hugging before and if it had happened in my house with my dog, I would blame myself. This was in a shelter. Dogs in shelters are not in a good place. They are scared and nervous. The same behavior a well trained dog would endure in a home is not the same type of behavior they will accept in a strange place with strange people when they are scared. If you don't know and acknowledge the difference, then you shouldn't own a dog (as the child's parents clearly shouldn't ... ever).
An example: Last night someone came into our store with their dog. This is a very calm dog that I have petted many times before. However, when I closed the metal gates to close up the store, the dog didn't like the loud noise at all. He was shaking, put himself in front of his owner, and flattened his ears. Despite wagging his tail, those danger signs meant I would not try to reach down and pet him at that time. That could possible provoke a reaction. And it would be fully justified in my experience. If I had done that and got bit, I certainly wouldn't have blamed the dog. It would have been my own damn fault for not paying attention to the warning signs.
I'm not going to try to hug a mugger threatening me with a knife, I'm sure as heck not going to try and pet a dog showing warning signs to stay away.
Hello; fair enough. As an adult I am careful when approaching a strange dog. If i am ever in the position to introduce a child to a dog, I will keep your approach in mind.
Frankly it is my experience that most dog owners do not know about this particular way to introduce kids to dogs. For that matter the dog owners I know of do not seem to have much in the way of the needed knowledge to properly keep a pet. I have read several of these dog threads and commonly find that "dog people" have a long list of such rules. Many, if not most, people have no concept of how to keep a dog by such rules. They often get a dog on impulse and after a few weeks the dog is chained up and is lucky to get food and water.
That the parents made a mistake seems part of the situation. That the dog is a bitter is also clearly a part of the situation. With few exceptions, dogs that bite should be put down. So far i do not see such an exception from what I have read.
