anybody selling p 14 or leo pups?????

[Nic]

look at the difference its like .5 cents different from mikes last order.... so currency is not the object or the reason... personally I think frank just doesn't want to deal with the usa... I could be wrong but I don't see how a 0.5 difference can mean a 1000.00 difference in price.....

 

[jdepasqu2]

look at the difference its like .5 cents different from mikes last order.... so currency is not the object or the reason... personally I think frank just doesn't want to deal with the usa... I could be wrong but I don't see how a 0.5 difference can mean a 1000.00 difference in price.....

That's not what I was referring to .....
I understand that the exchange rate has only changed 5 cents recently...., but our money is still almost half of neigbors across the pond...... it just so happens that everything is coming from over there...., hence the they are setting the price.... If the exchange rates were to even out we would see prices at least 1/3 cheaper....., maybe almost half of what they are now.... But that will almost certainly not change for a while....., we have a better chance of Mike producing more rays or the Brazilian export ban being lifted...
Sucks....., but what are we going to do.... I guess not by black rays for while.......

 

[Nic]

I don't think the dollar has anything to do with it.... I would agree to that if the difference between last and now was over a dollar but think that's just a front.... think about this cause the release from brazil is always brought up like its gonna make rays cheap again... if captives are selling for 1200-1700 and going good and quick then what makes you thing that importers are not gonna see wilds as fresh blood and still charge you 1200+ .... think about it fresh blood people will pay it.... pretty much just pray mike ends up with more than he can handle only way you will see 800 bucks on leopoldi....

 

[jdepasqu2]

I don't think the dollar has anything to do with it.... I would agree to that if the difference between last and now was over a dollar but think that's just a front.... think about this cause the release from brazil is always brought up like its gonna make rays cheap again... if captives are selling for 1200-1700 and going good and quick then what makes you thing that importers are not gonna see wilds as fresh blood and still charge you 1200+ .... think about it fresh blood people will pay it.... pretty much just pray mike ends up with more than he can handle only way you will see 800 bucks on leopoldi....

But thats just the thing....., they are already 800 bucks over there before shipping and the exchange rate......., that is what is killing us right now in the states....... the euro has like 40 cents on our dollar.... and the pound is even more..... so if that were to stop and the exchange rates were to even out it would be a whole different ball game......... But like I said that will probably not happen any time soon....... Funny: Our money use to be worth more than the euro.

If you had a thousand euro right now then you could buy a black ray.... but WE cant cus we only really have 600 us dollars (equivelent)...... its just our Pres. stickin it to us like he has been for almost 8 years now..... Unless your rich you have been getting it real hard.....

So say if the rates were to even out and then the ban is lifted..., then rays would be 800 or so because we would be cutting out the middle-MEN........

 

[cichlaguapote]

I understand what you're saying but honestly you're only trying to find a way around high prices with that thinking. Sure if exchange rates were different, etc but Franks price could go up at any time even if the exchange rate makes it so you could buy a ray for 800.00(figurative number) he could raise his rate for rays.

I agree with nic to a certain extent IF the ban was lifted you'd see wild caught going for more than CB, at least at first because everyones going to invest to get breeding themselves, not only people like Mike but other people who might not breed right now but would if wild blood was available again. Also importers don't set prices for fish just by what it costs to collect/bring in but by market rate. So if market rate is high then they'll be right around that. Expect to see wild black rays if the ban is lifted at least at first to go for thousands IMO..

Ban or no ban. These rays are in demand possibly now more than ever so I don't see prices coming down no matter what.

 

[jdepasqu2]

And there actually is a possibility that these two variables could work themselves out..., at the same point in the future....., who knows-life's a gamble.... still counting on Mike though....

 

[csx4236]

But thats just the thing....., they are already 800 bucks over there before shipping and the exchange rate......., that is what is killing us right now in the states....... the euro has like 40 cents on our dollar.... and the pound is even more..... so if that were to stop and the exchange rates were to even out it would be a whole different ball game......... But like I said that will probably not happen any time soon....... Funny: Our money use to be worth more than the euro.

If you had a thousand euro right now then you could buy a black ray.... but WE cant cus we only really have 600 us dollars (equivelent)...... its just our Pres. stickin it to us like he has been for almost 8 years now..... Unless your rich you have been getting it real hard.....

So say if the rates were to even out and then the ban is lifted..., then rays would be 800 or so because we would be cutting out the middle-MEN........

The euro has been killing the dollar for a long long time, and the prices of rays have doubled and even tripled in the last one year alone. So it really has nothing to do with the that at all. It is cause of the demand for rays in asia and what they are willing to pay for them, some breeders are selling there P14pups for 2000 euro a piece to breeders in asia thats over 2800 us. Prices of rays is going up cause of this problem and has nothing to do with the euro/dollar problem or I should say has little to do with this problem it is making the situation worse. Last summer leo were coming in from europe for 600 us dollars and now there around 1900 US landed. In august of 2006 the ratio was 1.28/1.00 euro right now it is 1.41/1.00 thats not even a 10% differnce and yet rays have not gone up 10% in price they have gone up 300%. So to me it has nothing to do with currency exchange. I speak to wholesalers in brazil all the time and small leo are being sold inside of brazil for 300 us dollars ea, now add on shipping and import fees another 200 easy and thats 500 just to land in the US. Then many people have to make there profit so you can double or triple that price. I would say a good price would be 1000-1200 ea even if they were allowed out of brazil in the future. Ow yeah one more thing to consider if they are allowed out in small quotas we in the US will be the last to see any, asia will buy them all up before you even knew they were released.

 

[cichlaguapote]

Ow yeah one more thing to consider if they are allowed out in small quotas we in the US will be the last to see any, asia will buy them all up before you even knew they were released.

So true... Alot of people don't know that or forget that. Or market is nothing compared to asias.

 

[Itaituba2003]

personally I think frank just doesn't want to deal with the usa..

I would love and already have several times sold to the US an really as I mentioned before prices, accept for black rays , are still the same in euros. We sell and several people now this on this forum only top qualety
Regards
Frank

 

[jdepasqu2]

"I agree with nic to a certain extent IF the ban was lifted you'd see wild caught going for more than CB, at least at first because everyones going to invest to get breeding themselves, not only people like Mike but other people who might not breed right now but would if wild blood was available again. Also importers don't set prices for fish just by what it costs to collect/bring in but by market rate. So if market rate is high then they'll be right around that. Expect to see wild black rays if the ban is lifted at least at first to go for thousands IMO..

Ban or no ban. These rays are in demand possibly now more than ever so I don't see prices coming down no matter what.[/quote]"



I also agree with this type of thinking......, That brazilian rays will just simply be in to much of a high demand for the price to ever go down....., But that is something that could change; This is the thinking right now because;

The organization that regulates exports of fish from Brazil (forget their name) does not have long term plan for the fish exports/management which make people believe that they need to get every last ray they can when they can

But if they could actually put forth a quota system for these fish and insure the fish trading industry that there will always be wild blood available. This would help everything...., and keep people form hording and selling rays for crazy amounts of money ($7,000 for example)

This would result in;

-less price fluctuations
-the ethical treatment of rays
-happy hobiests -sp-
-and knowing that these rays will always be apart of the amazon..... not just breed in captivity like all other beautiful exotic animals

just my 2cents......