Carp/goldfish hybrid

[MN_Rebel]

I was just wondering why your English seemed so familiar. I'm Newt over there.



That's my point- you don't know if your animals will have health problems before breeding them, but you do know it is more likely than if breeding same-species parents. It seems like that should dissuade you from hybridizing just to do it.

Yes but fancy goldfish and koi carp Always have health problems than even wild hybrids. Bloated, scaleless, skin infections, eye infections, kidney problems, deformed swimbladders, spinal deformites, deformed mouths & fins, they made these hybrid look so hardy than their fancy parents. But dont worry about it, fancy goldfish cannot breed with koi in same pond without A.I. I dont think OP will actually do it as goldfish and koi dont readily cross each other anyways, even if in same ponds and majority of culls went to feeder tanks (guess where the feeder goldfish come from...yes they were culls from their fancy parents and dont passed their standards).

Im sure no one wants to preserve "pure" fancy goldfish. If we want to preserve pure lines, we should focus on wild goldfish, instead of these pet store goldfish.

 

[Noto]

Fair enough.

But I think you're wrong about people not wanting to preserve fancy bloodlines- a lot of people want nothing more. There are whole organizations dedicated to saving rare breeds of cattle and sheep, and I imagine the same would become true of goldfish if any lineages became threatened by interbreeding.

 

[MN_Rebel]

Fair enough.

But I think you're wrong about people not wanting to preserve fancy bloodlines- a lot of people want nothing more. There are whole organizations dedicated to saving rare breeds of cattle and sheep, and I imagine the same would become true of goldfish if any lineages became threatened by interbreeding.

like Dutch Belted Dairy Cattle which is good example which they must be preserve. However the pure fancy goldfish are very rare as they can be found in Japan and few in United States. Most pet store goldfish are just low grade or mutt (like common x bubble eye or lionhead x ranchu). Sure Pure fancy goldfish (which breed come true) are very expensive and are worth to preserve. However i dont want to preserve pet store types as who knows what they cross with. Lots of expert fishkeepers prefer a fish with a history over a pet store fish. I would never buy any goodeids or native fish if they come from pet store as it doesnt say where they come from.

 

[andyjs]

LOL! I am currently student for Fisheries Management

What's your point? If you had a doctorate in fisheries management, the maturity level of your posts would be the same. IMO, the very first step to respect online is proper spelling and grammar. I mean a slip up here and there is nothing, but when it's to the point I have to read sentences 2 or 3 times to guess what a person is trying to say, the whole idea and validity of their post is lost on me.

Im sure no one wants to preserve "pure" fancy goldfish. If we want to preserve pure lines, we should focus on wild goldfish, instead of these pet store goldfish.

Well, koi more so than goldfish, but I'm sure there are purist goldfish breeders out there somewhere. If pure strains of goldfish can fetch hundreds of dollars per fish and tens of thousands for pure koi strains, I'd have a pretty difficult time believing no one wants to preserve them...

 

[MN_Rebel]

What's your point? If you had a doctorate in fisheries management, the maturity level of your posts would be the same. IMO, the very first step to respect online is proper spelling and grammar. I mean a slip up here and there is nothing, but when it's to the point I have to read sentences 2 or 3 times to guess what a person is trying to say, the whole idea and validity of their post is lost on me.


Well, koi more so than goldfish, but I'm sure there are purist goldfish breeders out there somewhere. If pure strains of goldfish can fetch hundreds of dollars per fish and tens of thousands for pure koi strains, I'd have a pretty difficult time believing no one wants to preserve them...

Maybe you dont know about me? English aint my thing, in fact Im deaf and dont use english as my language. Try that in sign language and maybe you should see why im struggling with these words.

 

[andyjs]

Maybe you dont know about me? English aint my thing, in fact Im deaf and dont use english as my language. Try that in sign language and maybe you should see why im struggling with these words.

I was not aware of that, so I apologize. Either way though, that's not an excuse for laughing at people because you don't agree with their perfectly valid arguments...

 

[meepster]

I'm not going to join this argument, but it seems more likely that the hybrids are NOT fertile because if they were, we'd see them everywhere since goldfish and Koi coexist invasively in many waterways.

Looking at a wild goldfish from China and a feeder fish, they look exactly the same body shape-wise.

The funny colors in the feeder goldfish are the result of people dumping their unwanted goldfish into the breeding ponds for the feeders. If you look at the feeder goldfish carefully, some have double tails.

Someone wrote an article about it a while ago. The site is now gone, but thanks to the WayBack Machine, you can still see it:

http://web.archive.org/web/20070807...l/articles/articles_details.php?article_id=85

The article is also copied and pasted without the pictures of the hybrids here:

http://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8942

 

[MN_Rebel]

I'm not going to join this argument, but it seems more likely that the hybrids are NOT fertile because if they were, we'd see them everywhere since goldfish and Koi coexist invasively in many waterways.

Despited your statement, we have lots of hybrid in southern Minnesota, only in murky or pollutated smaller lakes. And they are fertile too.

Just because you see goldfish and koi together doesnt mean they will breed with each other in the wild or in the pond.

 

[Nanoreefer]

Ok,I left this thread alone because I thought it would die.However,I am going to use my false mod powers and say:Stop with the arguing.It was a simple thread to discuss your opinion on this and if you've had/heard of them.And no,I wouldn't really try it.And yes,if it infact happened,I would keep it until death.I wouldn't release it.I see nothing wrong with hybrids.It's more of a personal opinion.I do want to keep good bloodlines perfect,but most petstore goldfish/koi have bad bloolines.

 

[meepster]

Despited your statement, we have lots of hybrid in southern Minnesota, only in murky or pollutated smaller lakes. And they are fertile too.

Just because you see goldfish and koi together doesnt mean they will breed with each other in the wild or in the pond.

YEs, but how come we haven't seen more than a few specimens? If you think that they are fertile and are breeding in Minnesota, could you provide pictures? I'd be very interested in seeing some of them.