F0 jack dempsey's

[caribemob]

Not saying this is the issue here, but I don't just take someones word as a fact; you need hard evidence.

well just a name isn't hard evidence buddy, come on be forreal. you guys buy your fish from a couple of people that i buy my fish from to but i have others that are new to the import business and are trying to make names for themselves, and its so funny that all people do is bash people that aren't in a specific crew, thats so ignorant. everyone doesnt collect there own fish and thats a fact, its sellers word of mouth

 

[HrHagel]

Yeah, recently i've kinda gotten that feeling too around here.

I have some wild caught fish, and i have posted pictures of them before, but i never mentioned they were wild caught, since then there would more than likely be some guy demanding an upload of a legal document stating that this fish is wild caught and the source.. sigh..

 

[cichlidinsomniac]

well just a name isn't hard evidence buddy, come on be forreal. you guys buy your fish from a couple of people that i buy my fish from to but i have others that are new to the import business and are trying to make names for themselves, and its so funny that all people do is bash people that aren't in a specific crew, thats so ignorant. everyone doesnt collect there own fish and thats a fact, its sellers word of mouth

Just saying I like proof; if you just go by someone's word alone your bound to get taken advantage of and believe me there are even a few vendors here that do it.

 

[darth pike]

A guy comes in to show off his fish, and this is what he gets out of it..QUOTE]

Anytime someone gets some uber rare fish, there are going to be questions about where you got them from. Most people probably want some for themselves. And wild dempsey's would rank up there as there hasn't been collections in that area of mexico for a long, long time.

well just a name isn't hard evidence buddy, come on be forreal. you guys buy your fish from a couple of people that i buy my fish from to but i have others that are new to the import business and are trying to make names for themselves...

... its funny because nobody questions Rapps or dan and a couple others, but question me and my sources, i keep telling you guys that yall are not theonly ones that have caught or own wild fish

You are right, no one questions Jeff Rapps or Ken Davis becuase they are established and have been for years. But I didn't see anyone question JoeFatFish either, even though he was bringing in two species that have been either completely absent or mostly absent in the hobby for years. If someone is trying to start up collecting in an area that it's been absent from for years, then GREAT!!! That's awesome. I would be willing to give them props for it but I would think if they are new, they would want their name out there for people to start ordering from ...

I can understand the defensiveness, this doesn't tend to be the most polite of sites after all. But if I was a new importer/collector, I'd be posting all over the place to try and drum up business.

If I came out with a bunch of rare fish and tried to sell them, I would expect a bad reaction without details. It's sad, but with the number of rip off artists in this business, people for the most part aren't going to give anyone new the benefit of a doubt.

I for one wish it were othwise.

 

[JoeFatFish]

Just tell me what you guys want, looking for, and I will most likely go! You can check out all the cichlids of Mexico in the Cichlid Room companion. Over 30 variets in Mexico alone of CA cichlids.

Talk about not listening?? Wow. We aren't suggesting you can't bring them back, at least I'm not. And JoeFatFish is collecting in a totally differant area. Yes, the area around southeast mexico is hard to collect becuase of the dangers. I'm not saying it can't be done either though. Some of us would like to know who's going down to ask about the rare cichlids in the area. If a person is able to slip past the dangers and collect, then perfect!! Perhaps we can see a bunch of cichlids that aren't seen in the hobby currently.

BUT without knowing who is going, how can we ask if they can get the cichlids we want???

It's not that hard to say "The collector doesn't want to be known" or "Let me ask the collector if he/she minds being known or takes requests and I'll get back to you." Sheesh.

 

[JoeFatFish]

I don't know about who or when anyone brought in wild JD's, but I know IRA is a good guy, and wants to do the right thing for the hobby. As far as collecting JD's, they are found as "far" north as Veracruz, Juan Miguel Artigas Azas accounts for several sites where the occur natuarlly. One can easily collect some from a vacation to Veracruz, or Cancun, etc...And bring a few back and spawn them. It is NOT impossible, given the amount of hobbyists that may vacation in trop. CA cichlid lands. I went to Costa Rica with my wife and if I could'a gone cichlid hunting, I would have.

I have no opinion on whether or not your fish are wild caught…
　
But in the 3.5 years I’ve been raising/breeding Blue Dempseys I’ve looked into many sources attempting to acquire wild caught Dempseys to add to the line. Every one of them has had the same response. That collecting Cichlids in the Yucatan Peninsula is very uncommon. That thee are legal restrictions as well as concerns created by ‘drug cartels’.
　
You are absolutely right, we are not talking about diamonds or drugs, we are talking about smuggling something that is worth a fraction of what diamonds or drugs are worth, and are more difficult to transport… but are also illegal to export…
　
Like Joe said, fish just aren’t worth enough to allow fish importers to afford the necessary bribes to bring them in regularly. I’m sure there are a few people who, one way or another, find a way to bring them in occasionally, but I’m sure the price tag reflects their rarity.
　
　
I’m not saying you, nor anyone else here, is “wrong” nor they are “lying”… I am saying that there are a couple of people here making claims that conflict with what is commonly shared… And as opposed to responding with simple details, most of them are responding with harsh excuses…

 

[JoeFatFish]

I agree on being able to get as much info as possible, nothing wrong with that.

I got lost after the use of the term "homie"...... ; )

I don't think anyone is insinuating anything that should upset anyone. Just trying to get a little background info. But again, the burden of proof is on the seller. That's why I limit my business to a couple of long proven sources. Should someone else want to broaden their market share, they'd be well served to offer as much information about their livestock as possible.

I think we all just want quality fish!

 

[caribemob]

A guy comes in to show off his fish, and this is what he gets out of it..QUOTE]

Anytime someone gets some uber rare fish, there are going to be questions about where you got them from. Most people probably want some for themselves. And wild dempsey's would rank up there as there hasn't been collections in that area of mexico for a long, long time.





You are right, no one questions Jeff Rapps or Ken Davis becuase they are established and have been for years. But I didn't see anyone question JoeFatFish either, even though he was bringing in two species that have been either completely absent or mostly absent in the hobby for years. If someone is trying to start up collecting in an area that it's been absent from for years, then GREAT!!! That's awesome. I would be willing to give them props for it but I would think if they are new, they would want their name out there for people to start ordering from ...

I can understand the defensiveness, this doesn't tend to be the most polite of sites after all. But if I was a new importer/collector, I'd be posting all over the place to try and drum up business.

If I came out with a bunch of rare fish and tried to sell them, I would expect a bad reaction without details. It's sad, but with the number of rip off artists in this business, people for the most part aren't going to give anyone new the benefit of a doubt.

I for one wish it were othwise.

yeah but how do you know for sure that rapps and his crew have wild fish he dont collect , and it was really funny that you talk about don conkel when the guy has done way more for the hobby then any one you know so for people to mstart rumors about him lying about wild fish to one of his counterparts is ridiculous buddy, listen to joe fat fish anybod can go get them varients and spawn them home , he said he could so why cant my people, you really dont make any sense at all

 

[caribemob]

Yeah, recently i've kinda gotten that feeling too around here.

I have some wild caught fish, and i have posted pictures of them before, but i never mentioned they were wild caught, since then there would more than likely be some guy demanding an upload of a legal document stating that this fish is wild caught and the source.. sigh..

forget these dudes if there wild post them see you have to understand its a crew on here thats trying to corner the market and actually always did with cichlid sales now its newcomers on the rise and people are trying to dog out his sources

 

[BigPic]

My $0.02 (for what it's worth) - I don't think anyone was questioning weather your fish were wild or not, I personally would love to see w/c Jacks back in the hobby, what is generally available to hobbyists is crap and looks nothing like a wild JD. I do think that you took the questions as a personal attack, I for one, didn't think that they were attacking at all. I had the exact same questions pop up in my head as soon as I saw the title of your thread. Weather they are legit or not, that doesn't really matter in the end, if you like em. . . who cares what everyone else thinks? If you were going to buy wild Beani, would you want to know what race they were (what collection location)?

For what it's worth, I am excited for you to have W/C JD's, I am looking forward to seeing more pics so that more people can see what a JD SHOULD look like and maybe aspire to getting more natural looking JD's (not all of these bent backed, beak faced things )

Ray