How Important Is Bio Media?

[Toby_H]

BTW - I had a 26G tank with no tank contents other than an inch of gravel. It supported five 3-5" cichlids for months with bi-weekly 50% WCs and only a power head for filtration/circulation. Ammonia/nitrites 0 the entire time.

While I do not suggest any of us use examples like this to start stripping filters off of tanks…

I do think it is very very useful for us to understand that things like this often do work… and use such facts in making decisions about how we filter our tanks… and how we make suggestions to others of what they should be doing…

 

[packer43064]

NC...Okay I really didnt understand what you were trying to get at with this whole "not needing Biomedia (or not alot at least)" at first. But after reading all of these pages thoroughly and trying to get the gist of what your saying, I think I understand what your saying. Basically instead of having a HOB or a canister devoted to Biomedia just use as is (filter cartridges, foam, carbon if you want) on the tank. The BB in the gravel, walls of tank, in the foam cartridges will keep the nitrates still forming without a whole canister or HOB devoted to Biomedia. Right????

If so then I have two examples which will help your situation here. I have a 125 with 2 Emperor 400. Nothing but plain old cartridges(they can hold 8 in total but two have carbon in them(I like the tank extra clear looking)). This is 800gph so around 400 is probably what Im getting, which isnt alot but it works. I would call the tank moderately stocked, maybe over stocked to some. After a week its only at 20ppm, which is great and I dont have any technical "Biomedia".

Also my 20 long doesnt even have a filter. Just gravel and two pieces of tile. It only has a frog in it, but still. Its been 2 weeks without a water change and the tank is only at 5ppm. I do want to get a filter it just hasn't happened yet, but just want to put it out there that the BB in the gravel and other places must be doing its job.

 

[Toby_H]

NC...Okay I really didnt understand what you were trying to get at with this whole "not needing Biomedia (or not alot at least)" at first. But after reading all of these pages thoroughly and trying to get the gist of what your saying, I think I understand what your saying. Basically instead of having a HOB or a canister devoted to Biomedia just use as is (filter cartridges, foam, carbon if you want) on the tank. The BB in the gravel, walls of tank, in the foam cartridges will keep the nitrates still forming without a whole canister or HOB devoted to Biomedia. Right????

That's not quite how I would word it... but yea, I think you get my reasoning here...


About your 125 gal... I find canisters typically push about 50% of their pumps max rating... but HOBs to move a lot more, closer to 75%...


My main motive in making and debating in this thread was to help people understand what they actually need.

Overkill is a common approach and I do not in any way discourage it. I just feel it is valuable to know what is serving your needs... and what is providing you with overkill...

Based on most of the posts I read on this forum, I'm lead to believe people think they need a lot more than they do, and they have a little bit of overkill... when in reality, they only need a little, and the vast majority of what they have is overkill.


Each of us is free to filter our tanks however we want, and I'm not asking anyone to change their filtration...

But when the new guy shows up and asks what he needs... It is important that we answer his question honestly and then him decide if and how much overkill to apply on top of his needs...


What I believe has happened... is time after time... people presented their filtration with overkill applied to it... and someone else thought that is what was needed, and then applied his own overkill on it and suggested to someone else that is what is needed...

And now the norm is to suggest to the new guy he needs aroubt 30 times more "surface area" than he really does.

I work in the engineering business, and we apply overkill to everything we design. But you guys apply FAAAARRRR more overkill to your "Biological Filtration" than any engineer I know applies to their designs...


At some point, excess becomes wasteful...

 

[thor meeki]

At some point, excess becomes wasteful...[/QUOTE]

I agree, however if a person doesn't want to do weekly filter maintenance, wouldn't excess become a handy tool to reduce time spent cleaning.

Wouldn't excess & wast become necessary under this circumstance?

I realise some fish keepers like to more hands on than others.
What about fish keepers that don't?

I think when a new guy shows up & asks the question...what do I need?
I believe the 1st words off the keyboard should be...well what are you looking for?

 

[Toby_H]

I agree, however if a person doesn't want to do weekly filter maintenance, wouldn't excess become a handy tool to reduce time spent cleaning.

Wouldn't excess & wast become necessary under this circumstance?

Sure there are different approaches to everything… and using different approaches will alter one’s needs… as well as what would be considered excess…

I feel “Mechanical Media” should be cleaned regularly… as removing waste from the system lowers the end byproduct of nitrates… Not doing so allows nitrates to build faster thus increasing the time frame and/or quantity of water changes needed…

“Bio Media” doesn’t need to be cleaned, provided you set it up properly and do not get physical waste in it. Not setting it up properly and using it as “Mechanical Media” voids it’s benefits. In this situation using more could be a way to service the filter less often, but using intelligent filtration would serve this function much better and could be done much cheaper…

I realise some fish keepers like to more hands on than others.

What about fish keepers that don't?

While I do enjoy doing aquarium maintenance, I also set up processes to account for times when life doesn’t allow me the luxury of spending the time on them I want to.

If you note the filtration methods I use and the suggestions I make always keep practicality in mind. I primarily use AC 110 HOBs stacked with media in such a way that I can clean half a dozen of them in 10~20 minutes… I also share how I keep all my filters on a single power strip so I can turn them all off with a push of a single button…

I feel practicality is a critical factor that often not enough focus is put on. Just like I feel initial financial investment is a critical factor…

I think when a new guy shows up & asks the question...what do I need?

I believe the 1st words off the keyboard should be...well what are you looking for?

I couldn’t agree more…

The problem comes in when usually the new guy doesn’t realize all his options, what the pros/cons of each option is, etc, etc…

And around here people start throwing suggestions at them without giving them any information…

Then someone (often me) gives an educational explanation, but it gets lost in the clutter of random suggestions…

And the new guy is left thinking he needs to spend $400 on filters for a 55 gal tank… and when he does he then posts a month later wondering why he still has poop on the bottom…


So I agree wholeheartedly that when the new guy posts questions… it’s our job to help him figure out what he’s really asking… and help him learn what he needs to learn to know the answers…

And that process would be so much easier without all the random suggestions flying at him at 100 mph…

 

[thor meeki]

You make alot of sense nc_nutcase.
I have enjoyed reading, & digesting this thread.

 

[esse]

This has been a very good read. I’m not 100% in agreement but I will say this is 100% educational. I am thinking sticky here.

 

[tcarswell]

This has been a very good read. I’m not 100% in agreement but I will say this is 100% educational. I am thinking sticky here.

sticky seconded This could save people considerable money.

 

[Jgray152]

Sticky 3rd and forth and fifth. Its already in my sig.

 

[thor meeki]

I agree... should be a sticky