I think we are being persuaded by the wrong people

[wild bill]

I am not PETA and know matter what the group especially one this large there are differences of opinion. We are a very proud group on here which we should be as we help each other every day. We should not look away from that fact.
As pet owners we should never believe we know every thing as no human is perfect. That is why I joined to learn from the wealth of knowledge on this site. But I do not believe animals are our equal o should they be treated as such. In fact it makes me mad when watching the news and the death of an animal over shadows the death of a person but that is the way this world is headed and it is not right. That was why I started this thread and Ebbi is right could have found a better title but it is catching on. There are defiately a few heated words being spoken but I kind of expected that. This topic when we learn where the world is headed with animal rights hits very close to home with many.
The fact that some people are just plain cruel to animals is a fact but these people re few and far between. Most of us have lost pets and hopefuly we have learned from our mistakes and will pass on what we have learned. If we don't then that is a sad thing. We often bash the lfs staff for their lack of knowledge. How ever it is often hard to find people who will work for that have all the answers your customers will have. While still being able to keep your business afloat. The more you know the more you are worth.
The goal here is to get us together enough that our voice will carry an impact when the goverment decides to cave to these groups.Some believe this will never happen but again I say it is happening every day.

 

[ehh]

I've learned in the past that arguing with ehhh leads to him grabbing at straws. How about instead of wishing the end of the pet trade, you gracefully bow out? The sense of entitlement is over 9000.

It's like I know I'm a human trafficker and pimp, I just can't help myself but if it ends after me, I'm cool with it.

Oh great... here this guy comes. Do you want to argue with me? I feel like you simply want to argue with me. Other wise you would've addressed one of my posts specifically and not a post about me. I'll take any response from you as a yes and we can go from there.

 

[SumoNinja]

i'm late to the party but I just wanna say a few things.........


my life is worth more than any wild animal

animals' lives are not equal to that of humans'

I would not give up my life or any human being's life for an animal's

animal testing must go on

and if ever my child is hanging off a cliff, and someone's pet is hanging off the same cliff, and the owner of that pet can only save one of them and then choose to save their pet over my child. I will then proceed to throw their pet off that same cliff and then the pet owner can join them after seeing what I just did to their pet

anyone that disagrees with me is crazy

 

[jaws7777]

I don't expect you to understand you've never been in my shoes. And I know that you and I have different opinions when it comes to keeping fish.
Working at that pet store completely changed my opinion on how readily available animal should be made to the public.

Ehh your right i havent been in your shoes you must of saw allot of dead animals and that sucks, but i have seen allot of dead people. Ever see dead bodies ? People you know and loved die and im not talking natural causes im talk murdered over dose deaths that could have been prvented ? Its allot different. Trust me someone always has more worn out shoes

I dont know that we differ in our opinions on fish care unless you know something i dont.

Charging 100 for an oscar or having some fovt douche tell us how to keep our pets is not the answer. Has our govt done anyrhing correctly the past 16 yrs ?

They would just use this as an excuse to raise taxes to pay for the pet keeping oversite, sign some b.s contracts get money under the table and push one or two product lines.
Nyc tax more on cigarettes than the actual cast of ciggs. Millions keep smoking, imo bigger govt is not the amswer.

Try seeing what i see everyday trust me your loss of respect for "humans" would be for ollot more than animal cruelty.

I dont wanna argue with you or anyone else on this thread we are all just giving our opinions.

P.s i never called you or kitty terrorists.

i'm late to the party but I just wanna say a few things.........


my life is worth more than any wild animal

animals' lives are not equal to that of humans'

I would not give up my life or any human being's life for an animal's

animal testing must go on

and if ever my child is hanging off a cliff, and someone's pet is hanging off the same cliff, and the owner of that pet can only save one of them and then choose to save their pet over my child. I will then proceed to throw their pet off that same cliff and then the pet owner can join them after seeing what I just did to their pet

anyone that disagrees with me is crazy

Good point... i think allot of poeples opinions on animal life vs human life would change once they have a child, hear that cry for the first time and allot of views change in an instant.

I for one would kill all my pets along with everyones on this site to save my child

 

[davenmandy]

Okay so pets die at the hands of owners, fact. It's also a fact that they die in the wild. And that they starve in the wild, and that they suffer from untreated illnesses in the wild, and people kill them in the wild, and that they get hunted by other animals in the wild, and that their environment is being systematically reduced on the wild, etc. etc. I don't know any numbers, but I'd say survival rate may be close, but even if it isn't I see it as just another part of natural considering we are part of nature...

 

[jaws7777]

I have no issues being judged by god...not some asswipe in govt suit

 

[RD.]

Because some people forget that there is always two sides to an argument. And I just want to remind everyone that there is reason behind people wanting to end the pet trade. Not just people being crazy terrorist.
And maybe it's only a neon dead here or a ball python dead there. But I promise you the way those animals died was not pleasant or "natural". The amount of dead bettas and hith I saw/seen is completely repulsive. And I don't need your opinion for that to be true.

For those that would like to educate themselves as to what really takes place "behind the scenes" so to speak, the article below is a good place to start.

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2004/5/aafeature



Every year, millions upon millions, probably 10's of millions, of fish destined for the pet trade die long before they reach the likes of the pet store that you used to work at, ehh. In the aquatic trade a 5% DOA (dead on arrival) rate is acceptable (Lim, et. al, 2003), and by most importers pretty much expected. That does not even begin to factor in the loss of life during collection of wild species, or post shipping due to stress.


http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/fa124

The greatest losses of wild-caught aquarium fish may occur during the handling period between capture, local exporting/importing warehouses, and transportation docks. While in transit, fish may be subjected to physical injury, extreme changes in water quality conditions, water temperature fluctuations, and indiscriminate exposure to toxic chemicals used as prophylactic treatments for disease control. Also it has been determined that mortality of captured fish from the wild can be species dependant. For example, mortality has been estimated to be high (e.g., 80%) in some marine tropical fish such as the Banggai cardinal fish to a low of 6% for some freshwater fish species such as the cardinal tetra (Chao et al. 2001; Gil and Martinez 2001; Vagelli and Erdmann 2002; Cato and Brown 2003; Lunn and Moreau 2004).

This is a harsh reality of the hobby that we all take part in. If one can't accept that, then you should start draining your tank & stop hanging out on forums that support that industry.

Or, you can spend more time and energy on educating your fellow hobbyists that share your passion of keeping fish, to make them better at keeping their fish healthy long term. Everyone here has something constructive to share, some just seem to take that a lot more serious than others.

 

[xraycer]

My sediments exactly, RD!

This is a harsh reality of the hobby that we all take part in. If one can't accept that, then you should start draining your tank & stop hanging out on forums that support that industry.

..........otherwise its just a hypocrisy

Or, you can spend more time and energy on educating your fellow hobbyists that share your passion of keeping fish, to make them better at keeping their fish healthy long term. Everyone here has something constructive to share, some just seem to take that a lot more serious than others.

Yep, be part of the solution.

 

[xraycer]

if ever my child is hanging off a cliff, and someone's pet is hanging off the same cliff, and the owner of that pet can only save one of them and then choose to save their pet over my child. I will then proceed to throw their pet off that same cliff and then the pet owner can join them after seeing what I just did to their pet

Absolutely!

If everyone was shown this sort of love as a child, then they wouldn't see humanity as being solely F**ked Up

 

[nd496]

I found this forum a few weeks ago, and thought it was interesting and informative. I've been lurking since then.

This thread has been very enlightening in that while I love the hobby, I never want to join a club, organization, or other community.

Great first impression, guys.