If your LFS is awesome is it okay

[Chillz23]

IDK what to say if they don't believe you, but it is well-known in the Fishkeeping world that 90%+ of your natural bacteria live in the filter and gravel and décor. They are really not a very free-swimming organism that just gallivants freely through open water - they need something to anchor themselves into.

I what I said had nothing to do with the bacteria or cycle of the tank. If you're doing daily 80% water changes the bacteria is pretty redundant, anyway!

 

[Woefulrelic]

Was his sarcastic smart ass reply to me useful in any way to this discussion and was it an unnecessarily abrasive retort?

I haven't read the whole thread as it looked like mostly bullying and b*tching. I offered my thoughts on it. I stand by those, you may take them or leave them.

I think it was less sarcastic as more of a counterpoint. Something that is extremely valuable in any experience based discussion. Exactly because we aren't doing hard science it is relevant. I don't have a problem with what either of you say, you just have to present it in a way that isn't toxic because it doesn't help anyone. If you want to share your experience with quarentine and use it to cross reference with other keepers it's a great thing, but if someone offers a differing opinion you can't just insult it. I'll agree that his posts weren't conducive to that kind of discussion but that doesn't make them wrong. Experience is everything in this hobby, particularly when it's topics too complex for science to tackle on a regular basis. The problems arise when one party states their experience as fact or assume anothers experience to be so. I suggest you read through the thread, it's a prime example of someone taking their empirical data and using it to insult others.

 

[Frank Castle]

I disagree. Temperature is going to fluctuate, no matter how hard you try to match it, adding chemicals daily to condition the water, PH will fluctuate slightly. Probably no big deal but also not stress the fish needs, IMO.

well, you can disagree all you want, but i'm stating a fact. the best fishkeepers in the hobby do partials daily and have seen nothing but beneficial results. It's your tank, you're welcome to do it how you want, I really don't care. Temperatures fluctuate in the wild sometimes in extremes over a few hours, 10 degrees plus at times. I know this from experience and I walk in the water when I go fishing so it's pretty obvious when the water is way colder or warmer the next morning when you were just fishing the same spot the previous day. Rainfall make a HUGE temperature difference at times and PH shouldn't fluctuate much at all considering you are using the same water source unless your water changes are far and few enough in between to allow ammonia/nitrates to cause the PH to drop abnormally low.

I what I said had nothing to do with the bacteria or cycle of the tank. If you're doing daily 80% water changes the bacteria is pretty redundant, anyway!

IDK why you say that, if you don't have high concentrations of natural bacteria, you shouldn't be doing water changes often because they NEED the nitrate and ammonia to grow and reproduce

 

[Frank Castle]

I think it was less sarcastic as more of a counterpoint. Something that is extremely valuable in any experience based discussion. Exactly because we aren't doing hard science it is relevant. I don't have a problem with what either of you say, you just have to present it in a way that isn't toxic because it doesn't help anyone. If you want to share your experience with quarentine and use it to cross reference with other keepers it's a great thing, but if someone offers a differing opinion you can't just insult it. I'll agree that his posts weren't conducive to that kind of discussion but that doesn't make them wrong. Experience is everything in this hobby, particularly when it's topics too complex for science to tackle on a regular basis. The problems arise when one party states their experience as fact or assume anothers experience to be so. I suggest you read through the thread, it's a prime example of someone taking their empirical data and using it to insult others.

.....and if they were THAT good at the hobby, they wouldn't need to be on MFK. Why go to a place to get help if you already know everything?

I got more experience and knowledge than a lot of hobbyists, but i'll also be the FIRST to tell you I don't know but a small fraction what I would like to learn

 

[Chillz23]

I was probably over reactive because I saw the chap before being insulted and belittled.

I've read all the opinions there is to be had on quarantine because I researched for months before I ever bought any fish (and a lot of the reading was done here), and from everything I've read/discussed over the years those are the conclusions I've come to.

Again, I didn't suggest anyone was wrong, I just personally think it's an unnecessary step in most circumstances.

 

[Frank Castle]

I was probably over reactive because I saw the chap before being insulted and belittled.

I've read all the opinions there is to be had on quarantine because I researched for months before I ever bought any fish (and a lot of the reading was done here), and from everything I've read/discussed over the years those are the conclusions I've come to.

Again, I didn't suggest anyone was wrong, I just personally think it's an unnecessary step in most circumstances.

start from the beginning of the thread and you'll see he clearly was insulting most members who were kind enough to waste their time replying to this thread. If his posts aren't belittling and talking down to people, then IDK what is

 

[Chillz23]

well, you can disagree all you want, but i'm stating a fact. the best fishkeepers in the hobby do partials daily and have seen nothing but beneficial results. It's your tank, you're welcome to do it how you want, I really don't care. Temperatures fluctuate in the wild sometimes in extremes over a few hours, 10 degrees plus at times. I know this from experience and I walk in the water when I go fishing so it's pretty obvious when the water is way colder or warmer the next morning when you were just fishing the same spot the previous day. Rainfall make a HUGE temperature difference at times and PH shouldn't fluctuate much at all considering you are using the same water source unless your water changes are far and few enough in between to allow ammonia/nitrates to cause the PH to drop abnormally low.


IDK why you say that, if you don't have high concentrations of natural bacteria, you shouldn't be doing water changes often because they NEED the nitrate and ammonia to grow and reproduce

Partials daily yes, but in a tank that isn't so small it drastically alters the chemistry of the water.

I know how a nitrogen cycle works, what I said was if you were doing 80% daily changes in a quarantine tank with one fish in it, there isn't gonna be any ammonia for the bacteria to consume and the fish is always going to be in clean water.

Anyway, before this gets confused any further. I've listened to what you've said, I respect what you've said but I also believe what I said has merit, too.

 

[Chillz23]

start from the beginning of the thread and you'll see he clearly was insulting most members who were kind enough to waste their time replying to this thread. If his posts aren't belittling and talking down to people, then IDK what is

Then please accept my apology. I've been here 5 mins and I've only tried to help.

 

[Woefulrelic]

I was probably over reactive because I saw the chap before being insulted and belittled.

I've read all the opinions there is to be had on quarantine because I researched for months before I ever bought any fish (and a lot of the reading was done here), and from everything I've read/discussed over the years those are the conclusions I've come to.

Again, I didn't suggest anyone was wrong, I just personally think it's an unnecessary step in most circumstances.

If this was your initial attitude I think you would have had a generally positive response. You show initiative to research the subject and a willingness to share your experience on it. Both very positive things. I personally think OP is trolling to get this kind of stuff out of us but that's purely speculation. I think quarentine is more important the more invested you get, things like fish lice can cause headaches and even in great conditions fish can become stressed enough to succumb to illness. (breeding aggression is a real issue ime) We are all hobbyists trying to better ourselves or help others, no reason to seek a forum out otherwise.

 

[Wailua Boy]

.....and if they were THAT good at the hobby, they wouldn't need to be on MFK. Why go to a place to get help if you already know everything?

I got more experience and knowledge than a lot of hobbyists, but i'll also be the FIRST to tell you I don't know but a small fraction what I would like to learn

I think of MFK's as more of a chat forum not so much of a reference site, granted there is a lot of good info archived just need to sort thru the opinion based posts as this site is open to everyone from the beginner to the experienced.