My Ball Python

[Ophiuchus]

...and REAL EXPERIENCE has shown me that live feeding isn't successful enough for the risks involved with it.

And to be honest, you never did give any genuine benefits to live prey over f/t. As Walls pointed out, there's no nutritional difference and no benefit physically, physiologically, or mentally. You only made points about how it could be done safely. So how does a snake benefit from eating live prey as opposed to eating f/t?

 

[elevatethis]

I've seen all of those pictures of that boa over at redtailboa.net....a board that is known to be almost militant in condemning those who feed live prey. Its also no coincidence that there are very few well-known breeders that participate in the forums over there.

So have we beaten the horse enough yet? Its looking pretty pulpy to me...

I usually participate in discussions until it turns into a peeing contest. I think anyone reading this can take it all in and make a decision for themselves either way.

 

[elevatethis]

...and REAL EXPERIENCE has shown me that live feeding isn't successful enough for the risks involved with it.

And to be honest, you never did give any genuine benefits to live prey over f/t. As Walls pointed out, there's no nutritional difference and no benefit physically, physiologically, or mentally. You only made points about how it could be done safely. So how does a snake benefit from eating live prey as opposed to eating f/t?

I've experimented with live, f/t, and p/k. At one time I had my whole collection on f/t. Since gaining in numbers and wanting to avoid keeping a large number of rodents in my freezer, I started asking questions and doing research on live feeding. I came across all of the various articles and horror stories, but noticed that the vast majority of those stories were being published by casual hobbyists and were snakes that didn't look all that healthy to begin with. After talking to a few professional breeders, I gave live a try. To answer your question, I've noticed my collection, as a whole, feeds much more aggressively and consistently on live food than they were with f/t. I can't really put my thumb on what exactly caused that to take place, but thats the reality of it nonetheless.

Just because our personal experiences differ, it doesn't make one of us wrong and one of us right. There's more than one way to do this!

 

[walls]

And to be honest, you never did give any genuine benefits to live prey over f/t. As Walls pointed out, there's no nutritional difference and no benefit physically, physiologically, or mentally. You only made points about how it could be done safely. So how does a snake benefit from eating live prey as opposed to eating f/t?

Yes before this horse gets beaten anymore I would still like a detailed explanation from you. What exactly are the benefits? This is the question that has yet to be answered, please elaborate.

I have said from the start that I dont care if someone feeds live prey. Not my pet,not my choice. I just want beginning herpers to understand the danger involved not to mention the inconvenience.
What are the odds that a new herper is going to get the correct size prey to begin with?? Since that is what you keep stating as the reason for rodent attacks wouldnt it be better to give advice against live food?

 

[walls]

OK my post came in after yours! LOL!! I guess we will have to agree to disagree on this which is cool, but someday, someday........

 

[Ophiuchus]

ok....agree to disagree...horse is now officially unrecognizable.

 

[synapse989]

just for the record I never said my snake wanted to hunt for the "thrill of the kill" ...that part's for me.

and also for the record. When I put the mouse in the tank, the snake was in her hide, and within a minute of the mouse poking its nose around her cave, she was on the other side of the tank, preparing for an aerial assault via the synthetic vines I have stuck in the back corner. I never saw her creep the cage, I never saw her climbing the vines.. ...I didn't even see the vines move.. next thing you know she's got her self in striking position and nailed the mouse when it crawled across the log.

..for the record, I'm going to believe that Doom did that for my entertainment. And I'm going to insist that she used strategy to put herself in assault position. Next time I feed her I'm setting up my video camera. I think having me there watching makes her a little nervous or something... at least.. I know she knows I'm there watching.

....and again.. having seen plenty of large ball pythons in photographs with no gaping wounds and stitches on their faces... ..how does that work by the way? ...large snake in the wild.. eating live animals.. perfect faces, perfect snake. ....snake in captivity.. taken out of its tiny cage and put in some plastic tub to eat gets a scar to remember a rodent by that it should have had the strength to crush like a toothpick in the first place...to be perfectly honest with you, the only thing I've really been offended by so far were those photos of snakes with wounds. It's my firm belief that an incident like that is one in a million in the woods.

When someone can explain to me how a ball python can live 20 or 30 years in the wild without being half eaten by rats.. ....oh forget it. I'll never feed my snake a dead mouse.. it's taking the snake out of the snake.

 

[synapse989]

"I know several large scale ball python breeders that have found live feeding of small rodent prey to be beneficial to their collections."

Just exactly what are the benefits of feeding live rodents? I would really like a detailed answer on this statement because it has already been proven that there is no nutritional difference, it is not safer, and it does not benefit the snake physically or psychologically. So what is it that i am missing here??

you using Freud or Jeung's theories on that benefit thing?

 

[Ophiuchus]

I thought I was done, but it appears that horse just gave a few kicks.

..for the record, I'm going to believe that Doom did that for my entertainment. And I'm going to insist that she used strategy to put herself in assault position. Next time I feed her I'm setting up my video camera. I think having me there watching makes her a little nervous or something... at least.. I know she knows I'm there watching.

If these snakes have no capacity to entertain themselves, what on earth makes you think they do something just to entertain you? That's just delusional thinking. Perhaps you need to take a course in animal behavior. Animals don't do anything unless it benefits them.

....and again.. having seen plenty of large ball pythons in photographs with no gaping wounds and stitches on their faces... ..how does that work by the way?

Photographers will take a picture of whatever they want to convey to their audience. If they're wanting a nice picture for Nat'l Geographic or something, they might come across an old scarred snake and say, "let's find a better one." If there's an article about this very topic in RM, then they'll go searching specific photos that support their cause. So you can't just go by the pics you see in magazines. (ElevateThis is obviously the better arguer of you two)

...large snake in the wild.. eating live animals.. perfect faces, perfect snake. ....snake in captivity.. taken out of its tiny cage and put in some plastic tub to eat gets a scar to remember a rodent by that it should have had the strength to crush like a toothpick in the first place...to be perfectly honest with you, the only thing I've really been offended by so far were those photos of snakes with wounds. It's my firm belief that an incident like that is one in a million in the woods.

You couldn't prove the statistics of that little belief of yours anymore than I can prove mine. There's been no studies about this in the wild (at least to my knowledge), so whatever numbers you throw in the air is pure hearsay. We don't know what the ratio of wild BPs living their full lifespan is comapred to that of ones who die prematurely of prey-related injuries.

I know the majority of wild anacondas I see in nature docs are all scarred up.

 

[walls]

just for the record I never said my snake wanted to hunt for the "thrill of the kill" ...that part's for me.

and also for the record. When I put the mouse in the tank, the snake was in her hide, and within a minute of the mouse poking its nose around her cave, she was on the other side of the tank, preparing for an aerial assault via the synthetic vines I have stuck in the back corner. I never saw her creep the cage, I never saw her climbing the vines.. ...I didn't even see the vines move.. next thing you know she's got her self in striking position and nailed the mouse when it crawled across the log.

..for the record, I'm going to believe that Doom did that for my entertainment. And I'm going to insist that she used strategy to put herself in assault position. Next time I feed her I'm setting up my video camera. I think having me there watching makes her a little nervous or something... at least.. I know she knows I'm there watching.

....and again.. having seen plenty of large ball pythons in photographs with no gaping wounds and stitches on their faces... ..how does that work by the way? ...large snake in the wild.. eating live animals.. perfect faces, perfect snake. ....snake in captivity.. taken out of its tiny cage and put in some plastic tub to eat gets a scar to remember a rodent by that it should have had the strength to crush like a toothpick in the first place...to be perfectly honest with you, the only thing I've really been offended by so far were those photos of snakes with wounds. It's my firm belief that an incident like that is one in a million in the woods.

When someone can explain to me how a ball python can live 20 or 30 years in the wild without being half eaten by rats.. ....oh forget it. I'll never feed my snake a dead mouse.. it's taking the snake out of the snake.

Well OK then.......wow.