Pterophyllum Altum with species of Loricariidae?

[fishguy1978]

I have kept Farlowella with angels and tried with discus. The F. would not leave the discus alone. I had a Black Moor in with a BNP that wouldn't leave it alone. The Moor now lives in the outdoor pond. I like the potential list of keepers though.

 

[TwoTankAmin]

I keep Altums and have had them for a number of years. But I also keep them at 6.0 pH which somewhat limits tanks mates. I also keep them in stained water with TDS in the 60ppm range. They came to me as wilds and I started them at 4.2 pH/30 ppm TDS and took six months to raise them to 6.0 and 60. I had 3 H. contradens with them. The plecos died over about 2 years, I am not sure why. I also have rummy nose in with them. The last 4 have been with them for a number of years. But they are also full grown.

If you are keeping your altums in water that supports the other fish you mention, then you can likely add anything you want. If you are keeping them in soft acid water, that is another story. You need to select tank mates who also thrive in such conditions.

Just as an FYI. Many angels in the wild tend to live in smaller groups within larger sized groups of discus. This is because the diiscus have their strongest living at the perimeter to protect the group. Angels take advantage of this. The one exception to this are Altums. This is because where altums live, discus do not. That does not mean it is not possible to keep them in the same tank.

If you have not seen these vids, here is a gift :

I have some Altums from the Atabapo.

 

[stiker]

There's no issue with keeping hypancistrus or peckoltia plecos with discus or altums, they won't bother either of the cichlids. I'd avoid keeping otocinclus with altums as they're small enough to be targeted by altums as a snack and if they lock their spines on the way down, you may lose both fish. I'd suggest bristlenose, farlowella, sturisoma or dekeyseria (L52 or L1168) for algae control

Thanks for your response.
That is what I have heard about otocinclusand why I was super on the fence. Some people have stated that has happened and some state the complete opposite and the two work well together.

I did plan to go with some dekeyseria (L52) however they are not available in Australia. I might get 2-3 Sturisoma Panamense or a few more farlowella vittata and some L201 (or maybe possibly some L046). Depending on what is available. It is difficult to find larger farlowella/ Sturisoma and was very lucky to find 4 f. Vittata

 

[stiker]

I have kept Farlowella with angels and tried with discus. The F. would not leave the discus alone. I had a Black Moor in with a BNP that wouldn't leave it alone. The Moor now lives in the outdoor pond. I like the potential list of keepers though.

How did you find the Farlowella did with the angels? For the most part it seems that Loricariidae are more an issue with Symphysodon over Pterophyllum

 

[stiker]

I keep Altums and have had them for a number of years. But I also keep them at 6.0 pH which somewhat limits tanks mates. I also keep them in stained water with TDS in the 60ppm range. They came to me as wilds and I started them at 4.2 pH/30 ppm TDS and took six months to raise them to 6.0 and 60. I had 3 H. contradens with them. The plecos died over about 2 years, I am not sure why. I also have rummy nose in with them. The last 4 have been with them for a number of years. But they are also full grown.

If you are keeping your altums in water that supports the other fish you mention, then you can likely add anything you want. If you are keeping them in soft acid water, that is another story. You need to select tank mates who also thrive in such conditions.

Just as an FYI. Many angels in the wild tend to live in smaller groups within larger sized groups of discus. This is because the diiscus have their strongest living at the perimeter to protect the group. Angels take advantage of this. The one exception to this are Altums. This is because where altums live, discus do not. That does not mean it is not possible to keep them in the same tank.

If you have not seen these vids, here is a gift :

I have some Altums from the Atabapo.

Thanks for that. My Altum tank is a blackwater setup and the ph tends to stay in a range of 5.5-6.5 (on rare occasion has gone to 5). My tap water is soft with a kh of 1, and a gh of around 3. My first choice for a pleco was the L201, but I might possibly have to find one that can handle slightly more acidic pH as most websites list the plecos minimum value at 6-6.5. I mostly wanted something that stays small. The L046 or L066 is possibly an option if I keep pH at a minimum of 6. The L183 can go in much more acidic conditions but I was looking for something not so common

 

[illumnae]

Thanks for your response.
That is what I have heard about otocinclusand why I was super on the fence. Some people have stated that has happened and some state the complete opposite and the two work well together.

I did plan to go with some dekeyseria (L52) however they are not available in Australia. I might get 2-3 Sturisoma Panamense or a few more farlowella vittata and some L201 (or maybe possibly some L046). Depending on what is available. It is difficult to find larger farlowella/ Sturisoma and was very lucky to find 4 f. Vittata

I have had locally bred Sturisoma grow from 1 inch TL babies to 4 inch TL (excluding filaments) in just 3 months. They were kept with my L46 and L173 as algae eaters and shared in the Repashy diet I fed the other plecos. My L173 also grew amazingly fast on the Repashy diet - I used a mix of Spawn & Grow, Bottom Feeder and Soilent Green.

My Sturisoma sp. and Dekeyseria L52 and other plecos never bothered my wild discus, altums and scalare

 

[stiker]

I have had locally bred Sturisoma grow from 1 inch TL babies to 4 inch TL (excluding filaments) in just 3 months. They were kept with my L46 and L173 as algae eaters and shared in the Repashy diet I fed the other plecos. My L173 also grew amazingly fast on the Repashy diet - I used a mix of Spawn & Grow, Bottom Feeder and Soilent Green.

My Sturisoma sp. and Dekeyseria L52 and other plecos never bothered my wild discus, altums and scalare

Wow that is quick, I might see if I can find any Sturisoma around, I might consider some L168 like you suggested. The L046 also has the bonus of stayed at around 8cm in size (from what I have read) whereas most the other small species attain around 12cm. It would also depend on availability as in Australia we have periods where species are available and then droughts of time where barely anything is available. I think the L201, L046 or L168 are at the top of my list at the moment.

Respashy is also limited here to the grub pie, morning wood and super green varieties.

 

[fishhead0103666]

Ive kept several different plecos with angelfish, the ones I remember off the top of my head are as follows,
Rhino pleco
Spiny monster pleco
Emperor pleco

 

[phreeflow]

the pleco eating slime coat thing is about plecos going after other bottom dwellers and slow moving fish (Polypterus, etc). I've heard of it mainly with Pterygoplichthys and Hypostomus species. I've never seen it happen with a well fed "happy" pleco.

I don't currently have any angels, butI have kept Pseudacanthus and Leporacanthicus with angels with no issues.

Agreed...most of the issues I’ve experienced or heard of happens to involve “common” plecos like hypostomus or Pterygoplichthys like Gunfleet mentioned or with chinese algae eaters sucking slime. i don’t think it’s fair to say all plecos behave the same.

I’ve kept most of the hypancistrus and peckoltia species (L46, L134, L201, L66, L260, etc) you’re thinking about with discus and angels and have had no issues. Many of them never even leave the ground...i almost never see my L46 on the side of the glass. I can’t imagine them swimming up to suck on your Altums. They are also carnivores and enjoy warm water so it should be a good combo. Just make sure your plecos are getting enough food down at the bottom.

I’d advise against otocinclus as they like cooler water temps and will not thrive in your setup and your Altums and discus and may eventually try and eat them.

 

[stiker]

Agreed...most of the issues I’ve experienced or heard of happens to involve “common” plecos like hypostomus or Pterygoplichthys like Gunfleet mentioned or with chinese algae eaters sucking slime. i don’t think it’s fair to say all plecos behave the same.

I’ve kept most of the hypancistrus and peckoltia species (L46, L134, L201, L66, L260, etc) you’re thinking about with discus and angels and have had no issues. Many of them never even leave the ground...i almost never see my L46 on the side of the glass. I can’t imagine them swimming up to suck on your Altums. They are also carnivores and enjoy warm water so it should be a good combo. Just make sure your plecos are getting enough food down at the bottom.

I’d advise against otocinclus as they like cooler water temps and will not thrive in your setup and your Altums and discus and may eventually try and eat them.

Thanks for your response. Always like to hear people’s personal experience on ideas I have.

At the moment I am leaning towards either L046, L201 or L168. With the L046 and L201 I am wondering how to ensure they are getting the proper diet they need when I always will have the farlowella that want a more vegetarian based diet. What did you feed your Loricariidae that you kept with your discus / Altums?

I don’t believe the otocinclus will be going in the Altum tank and will most likely stay in one of my smaller tanks