short body genes?

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I also agree with both post... The only thing I disagreed with was the 50%. Another thread I was part of was the superbowl spawn and we had a few short bodies but none shaped like the bp. But I want to also add that I never did cull for "sb's" so there could have been more produced from that batch. As far as the 2 month hybrids in the vid... They are over a year now and I kept and still have about 15 of them. I didn't see any obvious sb's at their size of 2 months or I would have pulled them. I showed the 2 month update of my texas fry to show at 2 months you can tell if you have short bodies or not.
Later today I will post a couple pics of what to look for in your fry so you will know if u have short bodies or not.
Again, just because they aren't shaped like a bp does not mean they aren't an sb. At two months there's no way to peg every sb in any spawn, perhaps the most obvious one's, but that's it. It'd be at least another month, possibly two, before you could id them all.
I love that everyone that disagrees with my 50% figure has absolutely no basis for it. There's always a disclaimer after they dispute my 50% quote "I wasn't looking for sb's." I wasn't culling for sb's" "I've only raised X amount of fry from that spawn" and my favorite, "there were only 2 shaped like a blood parrot." etc, etc, etc.
It's simple genetics, we can all agree that this is not a recessive gene, sb offspring show up in the first generation, that means it's a dominant gene. If you cross a dominant gene to a normal, 50% of the offspring will express the gene, full stop, period, the end.
I also love that even when I was proving this all out, and consistently producing fairly high quality sb texas, no one believed it then either...yet no one could explain how I was doing it. And I might add, no one else was doing it at the time. Weird right?
 
And I wouldn't be so vehement about this crush, if you hadn't shown a video of the superbowl spawn clearly showing literally dozens & dozens of sb fry, that you didn't recognize apparently. You could have picked out at least two-three dozen with a perfect bonsai body type...had you known what they were. And that still would've left dozens more that were indeed sb.
 
Again, just because they aren't shaped like a bp does not mean they aren't an sb. At two months there's no way to peg every sb in any spawn, perhaps the most obvious one's, but that's it. It'd be at least another month, possibly two, before you could id them all.
I love that everyone that disagrees with my 50% figure has absolutely no basis for it. There's always a disclaimer after they dispute my 50% quote "I wasn't looking for sb's." I wasn't culling for sb's" "I've only raised X amount of fry from that spawn" and my favorite, "there were only 2 shaped like a blood parrot." etc, etc, etc.
It's simple genetics, we can all agree that this is not a recessive gene, sb offspring show up in the first generation, that means it's a dominant gene. If you cross a dominant gene to a normal, 50% of the offspring will express the gene, full stop, period, the end.
I also love that even when I was proving this all out, and consistently producing fairly high quality sb texas, no one believed it then either...yet no one could explain how I was doing it. And I might add, no one else was doing it at the time. Weird right?

It's nice to see you can quote what was said... But didn't bother to take a second to read anything I have wrote?
I will admit that my knowledge of a dominant gene is off. I was thinking like a convict... They definately have a dominant gene. As far as the superbowl spawn... I never said I didn't have any shortbodies. If you had read what I wrote earlier I said I was familiar with the shorter than normal shapes. There were a few short bodies not dozens(but none shaped like the bp). The vid I showed of all the fry was NOT from the super bowl spawn and was from a completely different pair. I haven't just had 1 spawn with a short body to come to my conclusion. Not saying you only had 1 either, I'm just saying I do have some knowledge/proof of what I'm saying. So for you to come up with a 50% average you must have grown out some fish to know that... Where's your video/thread of a reg and a short body producing 50% short bodies?
Nothing is weird about you line breeding and creating more short bodies... I don't understand how people couldn't understand how you did it when line breeding has been going on for years.
Now to sum up what I have said... Op You will get short bodies when you breed a short body to a regular shape BUT you will get very few to none that look exactly like the bonsai. Good luck with your spawns and be sure to make threads of them.
 
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sb far left
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sb far right
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sb right in the middle
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The one on the left in back is sb while the one in the back on the right is a regular. Some straighten up more than others as they get bigger and that is what makes the different lengths. But as you can see they look different from birth.

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View attachment 976261
sb far left
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sb far right
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sb right in the middle
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The one on the left in back is sb while the one in the back on the right is a regular. Some straighten up more than others as they get bigger and that is what makes the different lengths. But as you can see they look different from birth.

The only thing I have to add to this conversation is to again urge you to reconsider what stock you're using, and advising others to use, quality hybrid sb stock should never look like these pics, ever! Out of all the sb spawns I've had, none of the fry had spines like this, if they had I'd have immediately culled them. And if there'd been as many as you have in these pics, I'd have sold off the parents with a warning to the new owner.
 
The only thing I have to add to this conversation is to again urge you to reconsider what stock you're using, and advising others to use, quality hybrid sb stock should never look like these pics, ever! Out of all the sb spawns I've had, none of the fry had spines like this, if they had I'd have immediately culled them. And if there'd been as many as you have in these pics, I'd have sold off the parents with a warning to the new owner.


I would expect you to say something like this... I never asked you what you think of them so your opinion doesn't matter. You say they shouldn't look like this but you still wont provide pics of anything. The ones with the straight spines turn out normal... While the ones with a zig zag pattern end up short. Its really not that sophisticated as you make it seem. There's nothing wrong with the fish because they are the same ones I chose to grow out(in which you already said will be interesting). I'm not sure what your motive is but it seems like its to discourage more than anything. I will continue growing out my sb and do what I will with them and the parents. Thanks
 
I would like to say that the first three pics are of a short deformity. I said earlier that it was one of the ones I kept but I can't say that for sure because I did do some more culling after I sorted through them and the regular shaped ones. So it might have been one that I culled.
I basically was showing how you will see a difference in how they look as fry vs a normal bodied fish as fry. You will see a zig zag pattern. The last 2 pics are of one when they were a little older, but it is not ball shaped. I only had 1 shaped like a ball from the fry I kept. For some odd reason I'm positive this pair produced more ball shapes that I didn't keep, but I'm happy with the one. In the end, you will have to cull for what you want to grow out that shape that you want.
 
Be sure to let us know how many you get from the initial cross. Like I said... I have no knowledge on bonsai genes but I am interested in learning about them.

sure thing...when I get them to breed

my bonsai fh pair is just ignoring each other but they are territorial which I think is a good sign

my fh x bp is just being introduced...male is interested but the female is running away
 
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