Stingray Export Ban cancellation

[csx4236]

 

[csx4236]

Now that rays are becoming available why are people who breed them or have an interest financially etc telling people not to buy em and leave them to the breeders?

Which breeders are saying not to buy wild caught?

 

[nickdog98]

buyers can buy what they want..my prices are what they are bc they were CB and bought well before any band or 3" skinny WC landed..sorry I can't compete with those prices.
And I just like CB rays, my opinion only! At my price is 0 profit I brought these in when 0 were available and everyone Posted how the US needed hystrix and scobina. So I put my $ up brought some in for hobbyists and I'm the bad guy?

Hope I didn't piss off the ray Gods

 

[Marius]

Which breeders are saying not to buy wild caught?

He's probably talking about me, I did mention several times that instead of the huge loses that Asia experienced it would be better to stick to CB and just let breeders enrich their bloodlines ...

 

[ewurm]

He's probably talking about me, I did mention several times that instead of the huge loses that Asia experienced it would be better to stick to CB and just let breeders enrich their bloodlines ...

I'd like to see the expansion of breeding programs for rays. I think the export ban actually is positive in the regard that

1. There isn't enough info out there to know if the exportation of rays from Brazil is/was having a severely negative effect on populations of rays endemic to small geographic regions.

2. The expansion of breeding programs will only drive the prices down as more become available

3. Captive breeding is the best possible solution to conserving the resource.

If, in the future, more research is done on the endemic populations of Brazil, and it is found that the populations can sustain a limited export quota that is both manageable and accurate, then it would be easier to support it. Right now, some of the attitude seems to represent a lack of caring about the resource, as long as some people can keep and/or sell them. I'd rather see breeding programs reach a level that can better meet demand and also be complemented by fresh bloodlines from a sustainable ray export from Brazil that is supported by research and data from IBAMA and other worldwide organizations showing that a sustainable export is possible, and that regulation and enforcement can minimize the ilegal trade in these species.

Do I want a Leopoldi or A Henlei? Absolutely! I don't really want to pay $3000, and I don't want to contribute to the possible problem. If that's the case, I'd rather stick with Motoros.

 

[csx4236]

I'd like to see the expansion of breeding programs for rays. I think the export ban actually is positive in the regard that

1. There isn't enough info out there to know if the exportation of rays from Brazil is/was having a severely negative effect on populations of rays endemic to small geographic regions.

2. The expansion of breeding programs will only drive the prices down as more become available

3. Captive breeding is the best possible solution to conserving the resource.

If, in the future, more research is done on the endemic populations of Brazil, and it is found that the populations can sustain a limited export quota that is both manageable and accurate, then it would be easier to support it. Right now, some of the attitude seems to represent a lack of caring about the resource, as long as some people can keep and/or sell them. I'd rather see breeding programs reach a level that can better meet demand and also be complemented by fresh bloodlines from a sustainable ray export from Brazil that is supported by research and data from IBAMA and other worldwide organizations showing that a sustainable export is possible, and that regulation and enforcement can minimize the ilegal trade in these species.

Do I want a Leopoldi or A Henlei? Absolutely! I don't really want to pay $3000, and I don't want to contribute to the possible problem. If that's the case, I'd rather stick with Motoros.

Educated way to look at the whole situation well said.

 

[ewurm]

Educated way to look at the whole situation well said.

Appreciated, it took a lot of reading to come to that conclusion. There is information out there, and most of it says there isn't enough information to support or oppose a ban from Brazil. It takes a lot of sifting through the chaff to come to that conclusion.

 

[ewurm]

I think a key issue to look at is CITES involvement. In case anyone missed my link, I'll copy and paste the pertinent part:

Conservation and management of freshwater stingrays
This was clearly the most directly relevant topic for the ornamental fish industry, and a serial that has
gone on since AC20 in Johannesburg, 2004, when it was first entered on the agenda of the Shark
Working Group. While there in the past have been suggestions that all Potamotrygonidae might
qualify for a CITES listing and considerable trade restrictions, the information repeatedly provided by
and emphasized by our industry has to a large extent shifted the general opinion towards a more
trade favourable view.
In the working group IUCN (World Conservation Union) shark specialist Sarah Fowler gave a very
strong message that sustainable trade might be the best hope the freshwater stingrays have, since
without the economical value given them by our industry's demand they are merely regarded as pest
and nuisance species in most of their range.
On the issue of freshwater stingrays, the working group's report (AC23 WG6 Doc. 1) specifically
states (quote):
"...the working group emphasised the need for a workshop on the South American freshwater
stingrays, following an update from the Ornamental Fish International on the status of trade in these
species. The [CITES] Secretariat reported that it had consulted with FAO and with their experts and
OFI report from CITES AC23
regional bodies in the region [i.e. South America], who are keen to collaborate in this initiative, and
the Secretariat has included this workshop in their list of funding requirements."
A workshop aimed at clarifying the population, biology and trade situation for the Potamotrygonidae
is regarded to be necessary to halt any plans to list species on the CITES appendices.
It should be noted that the CITES Secretariat specifically approached OFI requesting help to find
funders or co‐funders for a workshop from within our industry.

CITES is looking at the situation and is trying to gather the funds to determine a course of action. If they get the funding for a workshop, and they determine that the species in question warrant a listing, we may not need to worry about Brazil's export quota, as the fish may be listed. It all depends on them getting the money for the workshop and what category they would be listed in.


From what I can get out of that statement, they want more information, and if they don't get it they may make an arbitrary listing without it. It sounds like they are willing to send the fire department to put out a fire that may or may not exist, depending on whether they can get the information they want.

 

[Gr8KarmaSF]

Any idea on the workshop timeline and how this works?

 

[ewurm]

Any idea on the workshop timeline and how this works?

The PDF is dated from April. It sounds like they were trying to procure funds to do it, so the timeline depends on the funding. As to how it works, I would have to guess that they conduct population studies, export studies, etc, and make a ruling based on what they find.