Here is the surgery video again on the asian aro... everyone look REAL CLOSE now... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2LEclFiZAAhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Udx5Fx6pLQ
taking things in a different direction with drop eyes newest theory.
- Thread starter DeLgAdO
- Start date
johnptc, I suppose it could be fatty tissue I'm not positive, but it would say it's definitely either muscle or fat not a liquid sac or bacteria..... I'm going to go look for a diagram of a fishes eye... see if that will help us...
AwolAngler, Interesting theory on the overdeveloped muscles. I'm gonna have to ponder that for awhile.
As far as wild silvers getting DE, I beleive they do, but the DE is a disability, for a fish that food supply is at, near or above the waters surface. I don't see anyway wild silvers with DE can survive for any length of time. Slowly starving, becoming weak and eventually they become prey.
I beleive the head trauma is the cause, maybe it does not take just one shot, but the repeated head trauma substained from living in a small glass box. For those of your that stated that their aro has DE without ever hitting their head, how do you know this? Have you watched you aro 24/7? There has been times my silver has hit it's head and there is no physical signs of it happening.
A little observation of my 12" black aro, she is much more shy then either of my silvers. When she is startled though she does not blindly swim 200mph in any general direction such as a silver would. With her it is a quick short burst or a quick turn. I have yet to see her hit her head, although she has hit the top glass a couple of times with the back portion of her body/tail. Is this typical behavior of a black aro?
As far as wild silvers getting DE, I beleive they do, but the DE is a disability, for a fish that food supply is at, near or above the waters surface. I don't see anyway wild silvers with DE can survive for any length of time. Slowly starving, becoming weak and eventually they become prey.
I beleive the head trauma is the cause, maybe it does not take just one shot, but the repeated head trauma substained from living in a small glass box. For those of your that stated that their aro has DE without ever hitting their head, how do you know this? Have you watched you aro 24/7? There has been times my silver has hit it's head and there is no physical signs of it happening.
A little observation of my 12" black aro, she is much more shy then either of my silvers. When she is startled though she does not blindly swim 200mph in any general direction such as a silver would. With her it is a quick short burst or a quick turn. I have yet to see her hit her head, although she has hit the top glass a couple of times with the back portion of her body/tail. Is this typical behavior of a black aro?
finally found the darn diagram....
Sorry I know it doesn't show much but I couldn't come up with n e thing else...
Sorry I know it doesn't show much but I couldn't come up with n e thing else...
And they wonder why I can't stay away, this is the best entertainment in town! So what's the solution here? Te he hee
I put my theory in another thread on this subject. Has it really been documented that wild silvers have been found with DE?
Here it is again and other members have already made mention of the feeding habits of the wild fish.
"If you need a theory then here is mine. Some PhD doctoral student should study it. Silver aros evolved in acidic tannin rich streams and rivers in the Amazon basin. These fish were surface feeding predators and required large eyes and optic lobes to support their need to see in these dark waters as well as the branches above it. Since there are no barriers to leaping for a riverine fish; the enlarged eye was not an evolutionary liability until we started keeping these in aquaria with solid glass or plastic lids. The specific gravity of the Amazon water may also be different than that of the habitat of jars and Asians and may help support the large eye formation of the Silver. I bet that jars come from clearer water and are piscivorous as adults, rather than wanting to feed as much from the surface as they did when they were juveniles. Asians have clearer waters to swim in than silvers but also inhabit tannin rich water. Along with these other observations, one should also consider the more snake like appearance of the silver and the reduction of the caudal fin considering that these likely had a single ancestor before the breakup of the Continents. The silver moves by a series of pressure waves exerted against the water. This type of serpentine motion is not seen in the jar and asian. Can one of these touch it's mouth with it's tail? I think not. Therefore the fluid environment and hydrostatic forces are different for the evolution of the silver."
"If you need a theory then here is mine. Some PhD doctoral student should study it. Silver aros evolved in acidic tannin rich streams and rivers in the Amazon basin. These fish were surface feeding predators and required large eyes and optic lobes to support their need to see in these dark waters as well as the branches above it. Since there are no barriers to leaping for a riverine fish; the enlarged eye was not an evolutionary liability until we started keeping these in aquaria with solid glass or plastic lids. The specific gravity of the Amazon water may also be different than that of the habitat of jars and Asians and may help support the large eye formation of the Silver. I bet that jars come from clearer water and are piscivorous as adults, rather than wanting to feed as much from the surface as they did when they were juveniles. Asians have clearer waters to swim in than silvers but also inhabit tannin rich water. Along with these other observations, one should also consider the more snake like appearance of the silver and the reduction of the caudal fin considering that these likely had a single ancestor before the breakup of the Continents. The silver moves by a series of pressure waves exerted against the water. This type of serpentine motion is not seen in the jar and asian. Can one of these touch it's mouth with it's tail? I think not. Therefore the fluid environment and hydrostatic forces are different for the evolution of the silver."
The fish eye diagram is good but we need to see the outer musculature that moves the eye and not the muscles that move the lens. If my Silver ever dies, his head and eye is going under my microscope. It seems like the outer dorsal eye musculature is torn by head trauma as the eye diameter and weight increases with age.
