My new baby flowerhorn

[islandguy11]

When you get back to your fish, you might occasionally add vegetation. My cichlids will eat water wisteria, cooked brocolli, dandilion leaves, chickweed. The brocolli should be finely diced, the others can be rinsed well and floated, and mine will have fun tearing it apart. Otherwise add some type of vegetation based bottom feeder pellets. Algae, or Zucchini based are good.

Each to his/her own of course, but I personally wouldn't recommend feeding terrestrial-based vegetables/plants to a Flowerhorn (or really any other Cichlids for that matter). Your FH should be able to get all of those nutrients and more simply by feeding it a variety of quality pellets (esp. those high in spirulina).

Also regarding pre-soaking pellets, I personally would only do this if really necessary, or for a specific reason (e.g. adding medication or epsom salt) -- and then only using a small drop or two onto each pellet (e.g. via a syringe or pipette). If you soak pellets in too much water or for too long, you're going to leach out important vitamins/nutrients from the pellets, defeating one of the main reasons for feeding pellets.

 

[Fishflyer]

Each to his/her own of course, but I personally wouldn't recommend feeding terrestrial-based vegetables/plants to a Flowerhorn (or really any other Cichlids for that matter). Your FH should be able to get all of those nutrients and more simply by feeding it a variety of quality pellets (esp. those high in spirulina).

Also regarding pre-soaking pellets, I personally would only do this if really necessary, or for a specific reason (e.g. adding medication or epsom salt) -- and then only using a small drop or two onto each pellet (e.g. via a syringe or pipette). If you soak pellets in too much water or for too long, you're going to leach out important vitamins/nutrients from the pellets, defeating one of the main reasons for feeding pellets.

My fish do fine with 'terrestrial based' vegetation.
In fact they enjoy taking the vegetation apart. Some 'terrestrial' vegetation is included some commercial pellets. Such as zucchini in Terra's Pleco Wafers.

As for vitamins leeching out by soaking, well they are going to "leech" out whether they sit at the bottom of the tank, or in a cup. My fish won't eat hard pellets, ect. until they have softened up. They will spit them out until they have softened up.

Indeed each to his own.

 

[Fishflyer]

Each to his/her own of course, but I personally wouldn't recommend feeding terrestrial-based vegetables/plants to a Flowerhorn (or really any other Cichlids for that matter). Your FH should be able to get all of those nutrients and more simply by feeding it a variety of quality pellets (esp. those high in spirulina).

Also regarding pre-soaking pellets, I personally would only do this if really necessary, or for a specific reason (e.g. adding medication or epsom salt) -- and then only using a small drop or two onto each pellet (e.g. via a syringe or pipette). If you soak pellets in too much water or for too long, you're going to leach out important vitamins/nutrients from the pellets, defeating one of the main reasons for feeding pellets.

For islandguy11 As I recall the reason for the previous conversation was because my friend's newly acquired, small juvenile Flowerhorn was not eating. I had suggested that he tried soaking his pellets. I had also suggested (via his email or his thread) that he contact the fish store he purchased his fish from and find out what brand of food he was being fed at the store. After acquiring the same type of food and soaking it the fish began eating.

Your phraseology suggests my fishkeeping is inferior Sir. I resent the implication. I have been a successful fish keeper and hobby breeder for many years. Good day to you.

 

[islandguy11]

My fish do fine with 'terrestrial based' vegetation.
In fact they enjoy taking the vegetation apart. Some 'terrestrial' vegetation is included some commercial pellets. Such as zucchini in Terra's Pleco Wafers.

As for vitamins leeching out by soaking, well they are going to "leech" out whether they sit at the bottom of the tank, or in a cup. My fish won't eat hard pellets, ect. until they have softened up. They will spit them out until they have softened up.

Indeed each to his own.

If you're fish are fine feeding terrestrial vegetation than have at it bro -- and same if you want to feed Tetra anything, which most people in the know think is crap fish food overall. But you've been doing this for years as you say, so I'm sure you know better lol, each to his own.

And yes lots of commercial fish foods, even Hikari use terrestrial based plants, that's because basically they're cheapos compared to the companies that don't (like NLS). And there's certainly a difference in using such ingredients in a pellet vs. cut up and tossed into your tank to get torn up (would love to see how that affects your water quality), but each to his own.

Also I'm not saying feeding fresh land-based plants is going to kill your fish (unless maybe if you don't remove 100% of the pesticides they put on most veggies nowadays) -- what I'm saying if you'd get past your sensitivity and read more carefully, is that it's absolutely not necessary with a Flowerhorn (and I would argue the same for frozen foods and krill), but each to his own.

I don't have a problem with fish food lying around the bottom of my tank, I only feed in measured amounts and my fish eat the food soon as it hits water or lands on the bottom. Then I give some more. So I don't have to worry about vitamins and such leaching out beforehand. But if you don't believe the premise of what I'm saying, then up to you, each to his own.

For islandguy11 Your phraseology suggests my fish keeping is inferior Sir. I resent the implication. I have been a successful fish keeper and hobby breeder for many years. Good day to you.

Lol if you want to put it that way, when talking about Flowerhorn -- which you've kept how many?? -- you're exactly right, I am suggesting your fish keeping advice is inferior, but I certainly wasn't aiming to make you feel inferior, sorry about that. If you want to be so sensitive you cannot accept anyone offering a different and very arguably better way of fish keeping -- while you come on here acting like a Flowerhorn expert -- that's up to you, and sorry I don't really care if you resent the implication. There are some who powder-puff their responses on MFK, and there are some who don't -- you will run into both types here, just like in real life.

And it's called learning bro, and all of us with open minds benefit from it. Is this site now being overrun by Snowflakes?!? If so that's very sad because for sure it will stifle the exchange of information and learning process many of us come here for -- even if we may run into different, even opposing views.

If you really want to learn more about proper diets for fish Sir, I humbly suggest you peruse some of RD. 's posts in the Stickies of Cichlid and Flowerhorn sub-forums, it'll open your eyes about the how 'good' your practices are before you go around advising others to do the same.

 

[Rajan]

Looks good

 

[Fishflyer]

If you're fish are fine feeding terrestrial vegetation than have at it bro -- and same if you want to feed Tetra anything, which most people in the know think is crap fish food overall. But you've been doing this for years as you say, so I'm sure you know better lol, each to his own.

And yes lots of commercial fish foods, even Hikari use terrestrial based plants, that's because basically they're cheapos compared to the companies that don't (like NLS). And there's certainly a difference in using such ingredients in a pellet vs. cut up and tossed into your tank to get torn up (would love to see how that affects your water quality), but each to his own.

Also I'm not saying feeding fresh land-based plants is going to kill your fish (unless maybe if you don't remove 100% of the pesticides they put on most veggies nowadays) -- what I'm saying if you'd get past your sensitivity and read more carefully, is that it's absolutely not necessary with a Flowerhorn (and I would argue the same for frozen foods and krill), but each to his own.

I don't have a problem with fish food lying around the bottom of my tank, I only feed in measured amounts and my fish eat the food soon as it hits water or lands on the bottom. Then I give some more. So I don't have to worry about vitamins and such leaching out beforehand. But if you don't believe the premise of what I'm saying, then up to you, each to his own.



Lol if you want to put it that way, when talking about Flowerhorn -- which you've kept how many?? -- you're exactly right, I am suggesting your fish keeping advice is inferior, but I certainly wasn't aiming to make you feel inferior, sorry about that. If you want to be so sensitive you cannot accept anyone offering a different and very arguably better way of fish keeping -- while you come on here acting like a Flowerhorn expert -- that's up to you, and sorry I don't really care if you resent the implication. There are some who powder-puff their responses on MFK, and there are some who don't -- you will run into both types here, just like in real life.

And it's called learning bro, and all of us with open minds benefit from it. Is this site now being overrun by Snowflakes?!? If so that's very sad because for sure it will stifle the exchange of information and learning process many of us come here for -- even if we may run into different, even opposing views.

If you really want to learn more about proper diets for fish Sir, I humbly suggest you peruse some of RD. 's posts in the Stickies of Cichlid and Flowerhorn sub-forums, it'll open your eyes about the how 'good' your practices are before you go around advising others to do the same.

This is relating to advice I gave to a friend that had a recently obtained juvenile fish that was not eating. I had suggested he soften the food and find out what the food the fish was used to.

I also feed my fish a variety of foods including Hikari, Bug Bites, occasionally juvenile mealworms and once in awhile fresh finely chopped cooked brocolli in small enough amounts that they can eat.

The water wisteria, small amounts I put in my cichlid tank is surplus from my other tanks. They like to tear it apart. It is something they like to do as an occassional treat activity.

I have been fish keeping since the mid seventies, but I am always open to learning new information. As for you calling me a Snowflake...I grew up in in the construction business. I became a working manager of a construction company outside of my family. Started and maintained my own company. I presently have cancer, but still work and volunteer health permitting. I help people whenever I can...always have. A flake I am not.

I agree many pellet fish foods do have plant based nutrients. I didn't suggest vegetables all the time. Just as an occasional variation. My fish love it.

 

[islandguy11]

This is relating to advice I gave to a friend that had a recently obtained juvenile fish that was not eating. I had suggested he soften the food and find out what the food the fish was used to.

I also feed my fish a variety of foods including Hikari, Bug Bites, occasionally juvenile mealworms and once in awhile fresh finely chopped cooked brocolli in small enough amounts that they can eat.

The water wisteria, small amounts I put in my cichlid tank is surplus from my other tanks. They like to tear it apart. It is something they like to do as an occassional treat activity.

I have been fish keeping since the mid seventies, but I am always open to learning new information. As for you calling me a Snowflake...I grew up in in the construction business. I became a working manager of a construction company outside of my family. Started and maintained my own company. I presently have cancer, but still work and volunteer health permitting. I help people whenever I can...always have. A flake I am not.

I agree many pellet fish foods do have plant based nutrients. I didn't suggest vegetables all the time. Just as an occasional variation. My fish love it.

I'm not saying softening food is bad, I do it for my young Arowana as well, I was simply suggesting not to soak it overly long and to just use a tiny bit of water -- otherwise you leach out vitamins -- undisputable FACT.

Also did your friend try to feed the same food from the LFS, but first without soaking? He should have, because it's possible his fish would have eaten them without the soaking, thus negating the risk of vitamin leaching. K.I.S.S. is my approach. Many young FH when they're first brought home are shy and may not eat right away, with a little patience they'll soon be munching away on anything hard or soft you give them (though size of pellet is important), and if other conditions in the tank are good.

No reason to feel bad or like I'm attacking you for suggesting this, I'm really not sure why you originally took it that way, it was totally unnecessary (hence the Snowflake reference). I truly feel this is becoming more and more of a problem on this site -- we have to be so careful what we say or someone will take it as a personal attack or like we're trying to make them look bad when that's simply and really not the case.

 

[Fishflyer]

I'm not saying softening food is bad, I do it for my young Arowana as well, I was simply suggesting not to soak it overly long and to just use a tiny bit of water -- otherwise you leach out vitamins -- undisputable FACT.

Also did your friend try to feed the same food from the LFS, but first without soaking? He should have, because it's possible his fish would have eaten them without the soaking, thus negating the risk of vitamin leaching. K.I.S.S. is my approach. Many young FH when they're first brought home are shy and may not eat right away, with a little patience they'll soon be munching away on anything hard or soft you give them (though size of pellet is important), and if other conditions in the tank are good.

No reason to feel bad or like I'm attacking you for suggesting this, I'm really not sure why you originally took it that way, it was totally unnecessary (hence the Snowflake reference). I truly feel this is becoming more and more of a problem on this site -- we have to be so careful what we say or someone will take it as a personal attack or like we're trying to make them look bad when that's simply and really not the case.

I was not trying to stifle any ideas. I am all for the exchange of ideas, information, methods --- all students and teachers. What bothers me is when people take their aggressions out on these anonymous sites, and feel free to insult as they want, not realizing there is a person on the other end. That is how the person that authored this thread and I became friends. What had been a discussion between him and some other guys degenerated into attacks and insults to him. I had not participated in the discussion but came in and had his back.

Your question about my friend's time period of soaking, I don't know. I will ask him. I've thought about that vitamins strength becoming diluted with soaking too. I would think the vitamins are diffused throughout the pellet during manufacture and the pellets still have their base nutrional value -- shrimp, krill, fly larvae, spirulina, whatever.
I do know my friend soaks the food in the tank in his hand and as a by product the fish is eating from his hand--the beginning of a bond.

Some might argue constant dry food intake can cause osmotic imbalance. The balance of water pressure inside and water pressure outside the fish. (Encompasses other factors too.) And that in their natural state their food is mostly soft.
I am standing neutral on the effect dry food has on the water balance and digestion effects.
Long time fish Keepers have influenced me to soak my food. Now you are telling me their advice as well as mine is garbage. With me the amount of time I soak it depends on the consistancy;, a rock hard food gets a soak. A big food disk that needs breaking up is **** sure going to get a soak because of jagged edges.

Not only do I not mind a little extra food laying around, I like it for my bottom foragers. They get to it pretty quick.

 

[islandguy11]

I was not trying to stifle any ideas. I am all for the exchange of ideas, information, methods --- all students and teachers. What bothers me is when people take their aggressions out on these anonymous sites, and feel free to insult as they want, not realizing there is a person on the other end.

Oh goodness, the hypocrisy is killin' me...So you don't it like when people ..."take their aggressions out on these anonymous sites...." -- but for some reason you felt it was OK to act offended and then take your aggression out on my (quite polite) input just because it happened to be different than yours. Wow.

Also can you plz point out to me in where exactly in my original post I acted aggressively?? In fact I even went so far as to say "Personally..." (meaning it's my approach), and "Each to his own." (meaning I respect others' freedom to choose their own approaches), but even still you had to take it so personally -- and from that point the 'aggression' started, just saying.

And the other sad thing about such inability to accept others' input or view it as 'aggression' is that these little going's back and forth detract from the OP's thread (after all you could have just respected my input and not taken it as a personal attack), and they raise the likelihood the thread will be closed down, which often isn't fair to OP's.

So go ahead and get the last word if you want, but I'm done wasting time here, as far as I'm concerned back to OP's developing Flowerhorn.

 

[Fishflyer]

How can a person not take offense. All I was doing trying to help my friend's fish to get to eat and once he switched to what it was used to it started eating voraciously. You started with the disrespect right away. My tanks are fine and healthy with all my growing plants. The cichlids get occasionally a plant that they can play with eat or destroy. Usually all three. My water parameters are fine, you were indicating they might not be because of my vegetation. The plants convert toxins and release oxygen. Most of my tanks are long established. My new one is for my mating Siamese Fighting Fish and it is seeded from another established tank. Yes, I finished here too. I don't see this progressing anywhere productive. And I am sorry about that.