New Life Spectrum

[aldiaz33]

@ RD The reason I thought you worked for NLS is because I remembered you were always so passionate about defending their products. I see some things never change.

Accusing me of lying about their pellets not sinking? Seriously? Why would I do that? The reasons behind your stance are a bit more clear.

You've already admitted you've had financial incentive to promote their brand, so that explains your blind loyalty to their product. You're a salesman. Some salesmen will say anything in order to sell. I ain't mad at ya. The mighty dollar is powerful incentive.

I have no horse in this race; I just want a pellet that sinks.

I've been using NLS sinking pellets for well over a decade and had been happy with it.They have clearly made recent changes to their manufacturing process and somehow you feel it's something that I'm doing differently (again, after over a decade) as opposed to changes made to the actual product?

The older style labels didn't have any qualifiers stating "most pellets will sink." It simply stated, "sinking pellets," because they did actually sink.

I have a 10" Oscar and a school of eight 10" Widebar Silver Dollars that hit the surface of the water hard when they feed. When the SDs hit the pellets at the surface, then quickly retreat, they pull a good portion of the pellets with them (sometimes a foot below the surface) and guess what happens with the pellets? At least half of them immediately float right back to the surface.

In regards to your request for a video, get lost. I know how that will play out. I show you the video of the pellets floating, then you're going to repeat that I likely have surface scum (I don't), that I'm not throwing the pellets into the water with enough force, that to you it only looks like 25% are floating or that I must have left the container open, allowing the pellets to dry out (I didn't), etc, etc. Despite the fact that in the past 10+ years, I haven't had any issues, it's still somehow something that I must be doing wrong/differently as opposed to the fact that they did make changes to how the product is made.

Are you still making money selling NLS, or is your emotional attachment to their product a result of your years selling it?

The only BS here is your stubborn denial of what I am telling you I am experiencing using the new pellets.

Anyone that actually wants a fast sinking pellet should know about the new issues with NLS. At a minimum some will float. If you're ok with that, it's a great food. If you don't tolerate floaters because you don't want them getting sucked right into your filters and mucking up your water, you may want to look for a different brand.

Waiting on emotional response in defense of NLS from RD in 3-2-1...

 

[fishhead0103666]

*Gets popcorn ready*

 

[RD.]

That's funny, Viktor. At least in the end it all worked out for you.

I'm not sure what if anything New Life could have done better? Even if they put slow-sinking on the labels, would it have helped this situation, for someone buying online? I think not.

To the OP - the BS that I was referring to was you stating; "less than half actually sink". Less than half sink? Hmmmm. Yeah, what can I say I don't believe that. I've also been feeding this food for a lot of years, and have fed almost all sizes & formulas over the years - and I am not seeing anything like what you describe. You came here asking for input (from me personally), and I gave you some. If you still aren't happy, contact the manufacturer and take it up with them. If your post was a public service for the aquatic community, then so was mine. I don't see people flocking to the various forums having the same issue as you.

FYI - my financial motive would be what exactly??? I haven't sold fish food in several years, and when I did, I only sold to retail stores, and only those based in Canada. I actually turned down many online vendors who wanted me to supply them. Imagine that! I must be a horrible salesman. lol

I've been promoting sound husbandry practices, including how and what one feeds their fish, long before I was in the fish food game. Years ago I also spent countless hours volunteering as a mod on a well known cichlid forum long before I got into the fish food game. My passion is with education, and hopefully in some small way making this hobby better/easier for some people. I just happen to specialize in the nutrition end of the hobby, and I like to think that in that area I have always represented things in a truthful and fair manner. Even when I was selling fish food. I admit I was an arse hole at times, maybe still am at times, but I have always been honest & straight up. I don't make things up as I go along, I've been doing this for a very long time.

I'm also not blindly loyal to anything, or anyone. I even went so far to say that if they did what you describe (less than half sink) that I would switch brands. I guess you missed that part?

I don't personally know you, or your skill set level, and I have read a TON of stupid sheet over the years from consumers. Many right here on MFK. People who most likely have or had the best of intentions, but clearly didn't know what the hell they were talking about.

Perhaps you got a bad batch, from a bad production run, I have no idea, but I have 6 buckets here of various sizes & formulas (just a few months old now) and they all sink. So if what you say is true, I would take it up with New Life. Tell them what you described here, and offer to send it back. That's where I would have started.


And seeing as this is a public servicefor anyone that doesn't like any floating pellets, do not try Aqueon slow-sinking cichlid pellets. A large portion will float, for a very long time.

Cheers

 

[aldiaz33]

I've tossed a few NLS pellets into my tanks over the years- lol!

Bottom line: the new pellets I received don't sink like the old ones. The Hikari Bio-Gold Sinking Pellets sink like the old NLS pellets used to. So I've made the switch.

Is it possible I got two bad batches of different sizes, purchased from different vendors? It is possible. But after dropping $120 on two buckets of sinking pellets that float, I'm not going to risk buying anymore until I can be assured they will sink. No pre-soaking, firing them into my tank with a cannon, changing my filtration from overflow to canisters, turning off my pumps, etc, etc. Not going to do it. The old pellets were great. The new ones, IME, not so much.

FYI, I reached out to NLS this morning to see what the deal is. Waiting to hear back and will post an update here when/if I do.

If you have purchased NLS pellets recently (the new and improved product that "mostly sinks"), please share your experiences here.

Have you noticed a difference in buoyancy of the pellets?

 

[Rocksor]

Naturox 1mm Algaemax and 2mm Probiotix sinks almost immediately in a tank with sufficient surface agitation, canister output slightly submerged and pointed to the surface. It takes maybe an extra 3 seconds later in a tank with less agitation (sponge filters), more than 75% of the pellets sink immediately.

Aqueon does not sink after 5 minutes.

 

[fatboy8]

Used it a few years ago and didn't notice anything significant. Seemed to sink pretty rapidly once in the tank. I have two jars now of sinking or semi sinking and it has a pretty incredible delay. Luckily for me on my 65 this doesn't matter much since I have canister filters but I can see your frustration

 

[RD.]

These are the current formulas that I am using, plus a small jar of 1mm cichlid formula that I recently purchased. They all sink, pretty much as soon as I drop them in the tank. Perhaps in the past they sank even faster, and I just never noticed? I have no idea, my fish pound the food pretty hard, but most are not surface feeders so the majority of the pellets need to sink in order for the fish to eat. If they didn't, I'd be switching brands too.

I also understand the OP's frustration, but I think that he would have been better served contacting the manufacturer directly, versus running to an online forum crying foul, and stating things like they seem to be going downhill, and implying that they are using a cheaper vendor/manufacturer now. Especially when they are one of the few fish food manufacturers that actually make their own food on site, using their own equipment.

 

[aldiaz33]

Thanks for sharing Rocksor and Fatboy8. I'm hoping I just got a bad couple of batches.
I recall some people complaining that they felt their fish wouldn't eat NLS because the pellets were too dense. That was what I actually really liked about it (the pellet was very dense = less buoyant). This new formula seems less dense = more buoyant.

I heard back from a NLS rep this morning and it's interesting that their response to my inquiry about the pellets not sinking was to firstly promote their new Naturox product, just like RD did. RD, you sure you're not on their payroll?

Anyways, she recommended presoaking the pellets prior to tossing them in the tank and also to cut the power to my pumps for 5 minutes. Not going to do that when I can use a product that doesn't add those annoying steps to something I will be doing thousands of time and also put so much additional wear and tear on my pump (stops/startups are hard on motors).

My suggestion to NLS is to put out a sinking pellet that actually sinks.

We've identified that the new label on the package has changed from reading "Sinking Pellets" to "most pellets will sink." Let's drill down on the term "most." If we are going to get technical, "most" equals greater than 50% (most = majority). So even if 49% of the pellets float, their new label is still accurate.

To me it seems they realized this new formula is more buoyant, so they changed the labeling accordingly. I applaud them for wanting to be transparent about that. But I don't understand how someone could be so dense (like their old pellets) as to not realize how that would irritate people who bought their product (for the past decade) predominantly for the fact that their pellets sank quickly.

For someone who purchased their product for the sinking characteristic of the pellet (among other things), I will stick by my assertion that they moved in the wrong direction. That's surely going downhill for any customer looking for a pellet that actually sinks.

Do I think NLS is the most nutritious pellet on the market for your dollar? YES
Do I think it's the best choice for someone who wants a fast sinking pellet? NO- IME, not anymore.

 

[fishhead0103666]

Is anyone else thinking that this is being more complicated then it needs to be?

 

[RD.]

I'm actually attempting to help you Alex, including behind the scenes. If you pulled your head of your arse for a minute you might actually come to realize that. I mentioned the Naturox line as that is their newest line of food, so I assumed that's what you are feeding. Maybe not? I'm getting close to where I don't care.

That's surely going downhill for any customer looking for a pellet that actually sinks.

Haven't you noticed that thus far you are the only person complaining? Are there more owners with overflows having the same issues, maybe? Maybe those people have figured out a simple workaround, like the ones suggested to you. Not that you have to use them, but perhaps others have and have just carried on.

And perhaps I am wrong (it happens), but I still believe that suggesting that over half of what you are feeding is floating, is an exaggeration based on emotion, as your were/are pissed off that the new is not identical to the old, and you have wasted your money. Fair enough, I get it. Human nature and all that, but that's why I asked for a vid. Not a vid from you specifically, even though that's how you took it by reading your response to me, I asked that from *someone*, as in *anyone* as I was genuinely interested to see that. The reason being - out of six different new buckets - none of my pellets are floating. None! Some buckets and formulas are pre Naturox, others are post Naturox - but they all begin to sink as soon as they hit the water.

To be honest, while I don't want my pellets floating (except with maybe my midas, as he'll eat either/or) I would personally prefer if all the pellets that I fed, sank somewhat slowly, as most of my fish are mid water feeders. But they don't, they hit the water, get caught up in my filter output flow, and are at the bottom in the blink of an eye.

Rocksor seems to have had the same results as I did, and even went so far to state how they sink under two different set ups. Maybe Rocksor is on the payroll too? lol