This is exactly what I'm talking about. It may not be perfect in a tank, but with no predation or diseases that can't be fixed I'm sure if they could talk it wouldn't be too bad as some people act it is.
Some people shouldnt keep fish!!!!
- Thread starter JPCHAOS
- Start date
- Status
This is exactly what I'm talking about. It may not be perfect in a tank, but with no predation or diseases that can't be fixed I'm sure if they could talk it wouldn't be too bad as some people act it is.
Jeez people turn it down a notch... we are a civilized people, their is no need to unwind ourselves.
That's not a mainstream forum, that's the new MFK, where discussions exactly like that one take place on a daily basis. This site has shifted from old school fishkeepers with true monster tanks, and many years of real world hands on experience, to the new kids on the block, with their new tank that mom & dad just bought them. In many cases these same kids are now giving out advice on the forums, with thousands of posts behind their names in less than 1 year of keeping a fish, any fish, alive in captivity. What a farce.
I've been in this game & studying fish behaviour for as long as you have Miguel, perhaps longer, and what you stated in a matter of fact manner is nothing more than a personal opinion that is wide open to debate.
Not all fish prefer to be around other fish, in the wild, or in captivity. Many species (and individuals within each species) outside of spawning season, prefer to live a life of solitaire. Yes, when we attempt to keep some of these species in captivity we must cram many fish into the glass box to alleviate aggression issues, yet if we stocked as in nature there wouldn't be any aggression to begin with. Funny how that works. Also, many old bull males, lose their interest to spawn, and become killers of females in captivity. (which is why all male tanks like your mixed amphilophus tank "sometimes" work)
The fish that I keep in solo tanks are flying solo for a reason.
That's one take on the situation, here's another ....... 9 times out of 10 that poor sod that didn't spend the time or energy to properly RESEARCH in advance get rid of their "monster" flavour of the month & replace it with a new "monster" when they get bored of the old one. This is why one seldoms ever sees updates on umbee, or dovii, when they are as thick as my arm & 24" in length. Those enthusiastic poor sods got rid of them long before they reached 20".
I personally don't have a problem with heavily stocked tanks when maintained by those who know how to properly care for the fish in that type of set up.
What I do have a problem with is people who purposely set out to keep fish that due to not just their overall size/shape, but also their energy level (as in swimming space required) are knowingly (as in knowing better) kept in cramped quarters.
Perhaps none of us will ever match "fish paradise", but suggesting to a fellow member that it's ok to keep some catfish that can reach a foot long, a pleco that has the potential to grow over a foot long, and an Oscar in a 55 gallon is IMHO seriously messed up. If that's the quality of advice that this forum has come to, perhaps it's time for me to move on.
I understand the disagreement in regards to the oscar tank size as mentioned in the post you're referencing. I never said the pleco and catfish would be ok in there...I somewhat ignored their existence in order to bring up the Oscar issue. I really hope my post over there doesn't keep you away from this site.
If i was a fish such as a smaller sized cichlid, i would love to be in those tanks full of different cichlids that all co-exist well, no preds and no diseases and plenty of food and lots of cover.
Not lake malawi with nile perch destroying my family.
Not lake malawi with nile perch destroying my family.
Not lake malawi with nile perch destroying my family.
Isn't that Lake Victoria?
I've been in this game & studying fish behaviour for as long as you have Miguel, perhaps longer, and what you stated in a matter of fact manner is nothing more than a personal opinion that is wide open to debate.
Not all fish prefer to be around other fish, in the wild, or in captivity. Many species (and individuals within each species) outside of spawning season, prefer to live a life of solitaire. Yes, when we attempt to keep some of these species in captivity we must cram many fish into the glass box to alleviate aggression issues, yet if we stocked as in nature there wouldn't be any aggression to begin with. Funny how that works. Also, many old bull males, lose their interest to spawn, and become killers of females in captivity. (which is why all male tanks like your mixed amphilophus tank "sometimes" work)
That's one take on the situation, here's another ....... 9 times out of 10 that poor sod that didn't spend the time or energy to properly RESEARCH in advance get rid of their "monster" flavour of the month & replace it with a new "monster" when they get bored of the old one. This is why one seldoms ever sees updates on umbee, or dovii, when they are as thick as my arm & 24" in length. Those enthusiastic poor sods got rid of them long before they reached 20".
I personally don't have a problem with heavily stocked tanks when maintained by those who know how to properly care for the fish in that type of set up.
What I do have a problem with is people who purposely set out to keep fish that due to not just their overall size/shape, but also their energy level (as in swimming space required) are knowingly (as in knowing better) kept in cramped quarters.
Perhaps none of us will ever match "fish paradise", but suggesting to a fellow member that it's ok to keep some catfish that can reach a foot long, a pleco that has the potential to grow over a foot long, and an Oscar in a 55 gallon is IMHO seriously messed up. If that's the quality of advice that this forum has come to, perhaps it's time for me to move on.[/QUOTE]
To start, that poorly given advice was mine. I misread the info and understood the tank has 300 gallons.
It would be a pity if an old hand such as you left, but it is a free world, Neill.
I understand you are in it for longer than I am. We all have our experiences and their results and what works for one, may not work for another.
My Amphilophus comm works. That is what i want to convey. Some may not work, be it because the bulls don't want to mate, be it because they are mellow with age. I do not care.
My solo flyers also have their reason to fly solo. Yet,i still have to find a situation when i tried putting a solo flyer in a comm and it did not work ( bar Flowerhorns ). In all case i have had, they immediately adapted to the herd.
Beyond cracking me in the head for poor advice ( a mistake I corrected ), i see you subscribe to the respect due to the old timers and the job they did.
I see you subscribe to the new MFK status quo ( which you describe as a " farce" ).
You aptly criticize the people who do not do research. I second you in that critique.
( yet even those that do their research are cowed, nowadays, as you well know, because not everybody is an old fart like you and me who could care less about opinions).
I see you have nothing against well done " heavily stocked tanks". Exactly the loint j have been trying to convey all along this thread.
So, besides the well deserved critique to my above explained bad advice, your point is?
Not all fish prefer to be around other fish, in the wild, or in captivity. Many species (and individuals within each species) outside of spawning season, prefer to live a life of solitaire. Yes, when we attempt to keep some of these species in captivity we must cram many fish into the glass box to alleviate aggression issues, yet if we stocked as in nature there wouldn't be any aggression to begin with. Funny how that works. Also, many old bull males, lose their interest to spawn, and become killers of females in captivity. (which is why all male tanks like your mixed amphilophus tank "sometimes" work)
That's one take on the situation, here's another ....... 9 times out of 10 that poor sod that didn't spend the time or energy to properly RESEARCH in advance get rid of their "monster" flavour of the month & replace it with a new "monster" when they get bored of the old one. This is why one seldoms ever sees updates on umbee, or dovii, when they are as thick as my arm & 24" in length. Those enthusiastic poor sods got rid of them long before they reached 20".
I personally don't have a problem with heavily stocked tanks when maintained by those who know how to properly care for the fish in that type of set up.
What I do have a problem with is people who purposely set out to keep fish that due to not just their overall size/shape, but also their energy level (as in swimming space required) are knowingly (as in knowing better) kept in cramped quarters.
Perhaps none of us will ever match "fish paradise", but suggesting to a fellow member that it's ok to keep some catfish that can reach a foot long, a pleco that has the potential to grow over a foot long, and an Oscar in a 55 gallon is IMHO seriously messed up. If that's the quality of advice that this forum has come to, perhaps it's time for me to move on.[/QUOTE]
To start, that poorly given advice was mine. I misread the info and understood the tank has 300 gallons.
It would be a pity if an old hand such as you left, but it is a free world, Neill.
I understand you are in it for longer than I am. We all have our experiences and their results and what works for one, may not work for another.
My Amphilophus comm works. That is what i want to convey. Some may not work, be it because the bulls don't want to mate, be it because they are mellow with age. I do not care.
My solo flyers also have their reason to fly solo. Yet,i still have to find a situation when i tried putting a solo flyer in a comm and it did not work ( bar Flowerhorns ). In all case i have had, they immediately adapted to the herd.
Beyond cracking me in the head for poor advice ( a mistake I corrected ), i see you subscribe to the respect due to the old timers and the job they did.
I see you subscribe to the new MFK status quo ( which you describe as a " farce" ).
You aptly criticize the people who do not do research. I second you in that critique.
( yet even those that do their research are cowed, nowadays, as you well know, because not everybody is an old fart like you and me who could care less about opinions).
I see you have nothing against well done " heavily stocked tanks". Exactly the loint j have been trying to convey all along this thread.
So, besides the well deserved critique to my above explained bad advice, your point is?
I'd like to say that SOMETIMES keeping fish in an aquarium is better than the wild. For instance, take Lake Victoria. The Nile Perch is eating all of the fish and water hyacinth is blocking out the sunlight. In this case, I think keeping them is better than the wild.
But if you take a fish that has very little problems in the wild, and shove in a glass tank with a bunch of other fish, you aren't really making it's life better. Where in the world are fish NATURALLY found in a concentration as high as in a aquarium? I've never heard of a place like that.
But if you take a fish that has very little problems in the wild, and shove in a glass tank with a bunch of other fish, you aren't really making it's life better. Where in the world are fish NATURALLY found in a concentration as high as in a aquarium? I've never heard of a place like that.
i'm late to the party but i think some of these "old timers" with huge tanks would have stopped posting regardless of what the general attitude/feedback on the site was. it's just a natural cycle. i mean honestly, after they've been here THAT long, what can they stand to learn and gain from the site?
it's unfair to place the blame on current members for something that most likely would've happen naturally
it's unfair to place the blame on current members for something that most likely would've happen naturally
- Status
