Stingray Export Ban cancellation

[SovietFireExtinguisher]

Well if they get listed like the Asian Arowana. Everyone in the Sates that wants one or has one will basically be screwed. It's not like the U.S. government is reasonable and microchipping them will be acceptable. Unless you're in Canada. I call dibs on Mikes' stock if that happens. Joking Mike, I hope that never happens.

 

[ewurm]

Well if they get listed like the Asian Arowana. Everyone in the Sates that wants one or has one will basically be screwed. It's not like the U.S. government is reasonable and microchipping them will be acceptable. Unless you're in Canada. I call dibs on Mikes' stock if that happens. Joking Mike, I hope that never happens.

My stance is that if a listing on CITES is warranted for some some species, then so be it. There are several species of freshwater rays that seem to be sustainable. I love stingrays, and I feel the same about Arowanas. I am happy with a Motoro, and I'd like to get a Jardini at some point. I'd really like to have a Leopoldi ray, and I would like to have an Asian Aro, but I can be happy with what is available. My hope is that the breeding programs for rays expand, and captive bred fish become more available. It would be unfortunate for a blanket ban to occur. Hopefully with more research a better understanding of the impact of ray keeping and exports can be assessed, and a sustainable solution can be reached.

 

[SovietFireExtinguisher]

I'm just afraid that your government would just blanket them out and the hobbyists in your country would be hooped, not to mention breeders. It's like Zoodiver said, good luck getting a personal use Cites permit to keep a listed fish in the states if that happens. I'm all for protection of the species, and I know personally how they are viewed locally by the people who live next to the rivers that they come from. If they are put on Cites I think this will be more detrimental for them then good. Then farmers and fisherman alike will have no reason for "tolerating" rays in their rivers anymore and that could be more devastating then anything else that could be done in their natural environment. Cites is not a deterrent to a local fisherman who if he even knows about it would view it as an other way that rich countries try to tell poor ones what to do. Just my two bits.

 

[Marius]

The PDF is dated from April. It sounds like they were trying to procure funds to do it, so the timeline depends on the funding. As to how it works, I would have to guess that they conduct population studies, export studies, etc, and make a ruling based on what they find.

With the present economic status it might take longer than first thought.

I'd like to see the expansion of breeding programs for rays. I think the export ban actually is positive in the regard that

1. There isn't enough info out there to know if the exportation of rays from Brazil is/was having a severely negative effect on populations of rays endemic to small geographic regions.

2. The expansion of breeding programs will only drive the prices down as more become available

3. Captive breeding is the best possible solution to conserving the resource.

If, in the future, more research is done on the endemic populations of Brazil, and it is found that the populations can sustain a limited export quota that is both manageable and accurate, then it would be easier to support it. Right now, some of the attitude seems to represent a lack of caring about the resource, as long as some people can keep and/or sell them. I'd rather see breeding programs reach a level that can better meet demand and also be complemented by fresh bloodlines from a sustainable ray export from Brazil that is supported by research and data from IBAMA and other worldwide organizations showing that a sustainable export is possible, and that regulation and enforcement can minimize the ilegal trade in these species.

Do I want a Leopoldi or A Henlei? Absolutely! I don't really want to pay $3000, and I don't want to contribute to the possible problem. If that's the case, I'd rather stick with Motoros.

Thanks for elaborating my point exactly.

 

[ewurm]

I'm just afraid that your government would just blanket them out and the hobbyists in your country would be hooped, not to mention breeders. It's like Zoodiver said, good luck getting a personal use Cites permit to keep a listed fish in the states if that happens. I'm all for protection of the species, and I know personally how they are viewed locally by the people who live next to the rivers that they come from. If they are put on Cites I think this will be more detrimental for them then good. Then farmers and fisherman alike will have no reason for "tolerating" rays in their rivers anymore and that could be more devastating then anything else that could be done in their natural environment. Cites is not a deterrent to a local fisherman who if he even knows about it would view it as an other way that rich countries try to tell poor ones what to do. Just my two bits.

I don't think that a CITES listing would be detrimental, if they use proper information. They first need to get that information and use it in an appropriate manner.

With the present economic status it might take longer than first thought.

This is definitely an issue. Hopefully, the IUCN and CITES won't act without the information they need. The major factor here is the lack of information available. I hope they can find the funding to research the matter thoroughly, and make rulings that are justified by the information. Firing out restrictions blind won't help the situation, and neither will a failure to act because the money is simply not available.

 

[Marius]

This is definitely an issue. Hopefully, the IUCN and CITES won't act without the information they need. The major factor here is the lack of information available. I hope they can find the funding to research the matter thoroughly, and make rulings that are justified by the information. Firing out restrictions blind won't help the situation, and neither will a failure to act because the money is simply not available.

The lack of information is certainly detrimental to any future decisions, but, and I am not trying to be the devil's advocate over here, I sometimes wonder if IBAMA has any real intentions of ever approving or encouraging some serious data collecting. Why? Well, remember the Mr. Bleher episode?!?

The lack of money for research is not the only issue, the corruption, the bureaucracy are only two more things I can think of.

Who knows, maybe I'll be able to bring my contribution to this as well once I am in vet school. I'm definitely interested in the development of this story.

 

[rayman]

There are several species of freshwater rays that seem to be sustainable.

And this is the reason why the ban was lifted and there are qoutas for some species. A summary of the studies on reproduction of freshwater stingrays:
http://journal.nafo.int/35/charvet-almeida/22-charvet-almeida.html

sp. C there is the cf. histrix from Rio Negro.
Since then there was a study on leopoldi and an extensive study on orbignyi in the Parana-Tocantins area.

 

[ewurm]

And this is the reason why the ban was lifted and there are qoutas for some species. A summary of the studies on reproduction of freshwater stingrays:
http://journal.nafo.int/35/charvet-almeida/22-charvet-almeida.html

sp. C there is the cf. histrix from Rio Negro.
Since then there was a study on leopoldi and an extensive study on orbignyi in the Parana-Tocantins area.

Link didn't work. I'd really like to see that study.

 

[rayman]

Same study as word document:
http://www-heb.pac.dfo-mpo.gc.ca/congress/2004/Elasmo/4Charvet-AlmeidaReprod.doc

 

[Gr8KarmaSF]

Awesome link with info....