"Common" CB Senegals vs Nigerian wild caught. Diff Sp?

[twentyleagues]

Ya, dont see why not. Let's shower hendre with more spams of this Gucci Designer poly.......

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Ok so I care not for the sub/species/not. It could be it could not be. Without a dna test we will never know. It's like trying to compare humans well this guy has a bigger nose so he's gotta be a subspecies. But that fish! So freaking cool. It's like a cross between a sen and a betta! I want one. Seriously it's just a cool looking fish. Gucci or not.

 

[jaws7777]

So you're trying to say that it's pointless to speculate? Why get involved at all then?

I take it that your one of those people that are just too smart to learn anything. Stick around i find you amsusing.

Hendre
" I think the generic mass bred Sp Senegalus are a different subspecies to those caught in Nigeria"

-Cb does not equel subsecies....it means captive bread..... all cb at some point will have "deformations" depending how how far they have been line bred.

Hendre
"the physiologicaldifferences are too big to just pass up. "

-Yet these differenced are found in all the cb/wc polys we keep. Are we going to assume cb endli are a subspecies of wc endli ?

Hendre
"majorphysiological differences are a big indicator that they could be seperate"

"The main thing throwing me off is the tail shape, it's quite different and every captive bred specimen has this pointed tail type"

-mr wizard i take it your smart enough to know that HES COMPARING A WC FISH TO A CB. Oh wait in your 1st comment you mentioned that lol

Sure if you want to speculate go right ahead. I got involved to give an amswer to a question. You quoted my post where i gave hendre my opinion and more importantly gave him examples of why. Instead of posting facts or examples you resorted to throwing out insults because of a damaged ego ?

Im ordering my fire brearthing lap. Will post pics when it arrives

 

[jaws7777]

Hendre

"What do you guys think? Could P. senegalus sp "Nigeria" be a thing"

No. This is not an sp. And shouldnt be reffered to as sp.nigeria bro.

Sp.dabola/tinkisso is the best example. Its an undescribed species caught in those locations. Yours is most definitely a sen. Not an sp.

 

[TheLastKon]

Quick input. If we're saying that the op's Senegal is a subspecies because of the tail shape and possible head shape...then wouldn't that mean that those red long finned senegals should be considered a different subspecies as well? I think rather then a whole subspecies maybe just a few different genetic traits

 

[Mighty Wizard]

I take it that your one of those people that are just too smart to learn anything.

On the contrary. I'm here to find information I wouldn't otherwise find, share ideas, and in the process learn new things.

Stick around i find you amsusing.

Does saying that make you feel powerful?

 

[magpie]

Read a book man.

For the record I'm sorry about you being a simpleton. I didn't know that.

Why the insults? If you want discussion, discuss. This doesn't add to it.

I might be going out on a limb here, but I think Hendre merely meant to speculate rather than actually name a new species. After all this is a forum. And it's quite right that we wouldn't be able to properly deduce anything without several specimen, but speculating and sharing ideas can be fun none the less.

I agree that speculation and sharing can be fun, but as mentioned above, I personally don't find he premise of the original post that logical.

Let's speculate about potential subspecies! But just not in comparison to captive bred polys....

 

[Hendre]

Since there's lots of u with a CB Senegal. Pics below Just for fun. Do a comparison versus these wild Caughts. These Senegals were pulled from the lakes, drainage, pools, and streams for there pictorial debut.

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Very interesting, but the tail is even different here... To some degree

This is pure speculation, if the professor can do a DNA test then maybe we'll hsve some basis for this. Colours vary between fish yes, but shape is slightly different and morphological differences raise suspicions. Even from a Ph D geneticist.

So you're trying to say that it's pointless to speculate? Why get involved at all then?

This is the theory. I might be able to have mitochondrial DNA analysis and comparison done in future.

Difference in a population of isolated creatures from that of another is exactly what this is. Google subspecies "a taxonomic category that ranks below species, usually a fairly permanent geographically isolated race. Subspecies are designated by a Latin trinomial, e.g. (in zoology) Ursus arctos horribilis or (in botany) Beta vulgaris crassa."

Without scientific proof we can't say if it is or isn't what we think it is...

 

[Hendre]

Quick input. If we're saying that the op's Senegal is a subspecies because of the tail shape and possible head shape...then wouldn't that mean that those red long finned senegals should be considered a different subspecies as well? I think rather then a whole subspecies maybe just a few different genetic traits

Genetics can go further than visual, and this is referring to wild fish not captive bred line strains.

J jaws7777 we don't even know where exactly polypterus fit in the evolutionary chain, they could be ray finned or lobe finned or somewhere on their own (even through genetic tests on ornates).

Without scientific testing how can you say it's definitely not? It's certainly different to the wild caught fish Vancouver_98683 posted, they still look similar to those in the trade today in terms of Colour and tail shape too. I have suspicions, I must speak to the professor about genetic testing...

 

[jaws7777]

Genetics can go further than visual, and this is referring to wild fish not captive bred line strains.

J jaws7777 we don't even know where exactly polypterus fit in the evolutionary chain, they could be ray finned or lobe finned or somewhere on their own (even through genetic tests on ornates).

Without scientific testing how can you say it's definitely not? It's certainly different to the wild caught fish Vancouver_98683 posted, they still look similar to those in the trade today in terms of Colour and tail shape too. I have suspicions, I must speak to the professor about genetic testing...

The fish vncouver posted is a captive bred sen. This is basically the same way tiger and red oscars are line bred to show specific traits....same like an electric blue jack dempsey. Its not a subsecies its color morph.

Saying your wc sen is possibly a subspecies because it looks different from your cb doesnt make sense we've shown various example of the difference between cb and wc. Plus you only have 1 wc sen that we KNOW FOR A FACT is a sen. So how can you call it sp. Nigeria ? We dont need scientific testing to say that fish is absolutely a sen.

On the contrary. I'm here to find information I wouldn't otherwise find, share ideas, and in the process learn new things.


Does saying that make you feel powerful?

We always keep things polite in this section. We've had some pretty heated debates over the yrs regarding catch locations that were always kept respectful and even commical at times im not going to continue trading insults with you bud this whole debate is pointless.

 

[jaws7777]

Hendre read Troy1015 descriotion of his endlis. He notices slight differences between the catch locations...but all are still endlis.

Spend some time in the cichlid section and you'll see some cichlids of the same species will look slightly different based off the catch location im sure Stanzzzz7 could rattle of a few